Matchbox co-processor new users

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DutchAcorn
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Re: Matchbox co-processor new users

Post by DutchAcorn » Mon Feb 29, 2016 7:04 am

sweh wrote:...Could somehow who knows how add a 'how to upgrade' page to this? Might be interesting to play with Panos but I don't know how to upgrade the firmware. I know it's listed _somewhere_ in the forum...
You need a Xilinx cable, the iMPACT software and make a header on your copro.

Details for using the iMPACT software are here: http://www.stardot.org.uk/forums/viewto ... 70#p105623.
Paul

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Re: Matchbox co-processor new users

Post by hoglet » Mon Feb 29, 2016 7:05 am

sweh wrote:
fordp wrote:I suggest we crowd source a user guide here:

https://github.com/hoglet67/CoPro6502/wiki
Could somehow who knows how add a 'how to upgrade' page to this? Might be interesting to play with Panos but I don't know how to upgrade the firmware. I know it's listed _somewhere_ in the forum :-)
Do you own, or have access to, one of these?
http://www.stardot.org.uk/forums/viewto ... 20#p100220

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hoglet
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Re: Matchbox co-processor new users

Post by hoglet » Mon Feb 29, 2016 7:19 am

sweh wrote: Could somehow who knows how add a 'how to upgrade' page to this? Might be interesting to play with Panos but I don't know how to upgrade the firmware. I know it's listed _somewhere_ in the forum :-)
I've added a link to the signposts thread from the wiki page.
sweh wrote: Also suggestion: I see hoglet has updated the details for the new firmware, but maybe the selection table should have a 'before 20160228' and 'after 20160228' section for people still on the older firmware.
I've added links to dip the settings of previous firmware versions to the wiki page.

I think there's a role for both the wiki page and the sign posts thread. Some people will find one or the other first.

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Re: Matchbox co-processor new users

Post by fordp » Mon Feb 29, 2016 10:27 am

What happened to Jason Flynn's Interface?
http://www.stardot.org.uk/forums/viewto ... AG#p100198
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Re: Matchbox co-processor new users

Post by sweh » Mon Feb 29, 2016 11:40 am

hoglet wrote: Do you own, or have access to, one of these?
http://www.stardot.org.uk/forums/viewto ... 20#p100220
I have a Wiggler style JTAG programmer which I last used in 2014 to rescue a Seagate Dockstar (a "pogoplug" device) after I messed up flashing Debian to it. It's in the basement somewhere :-)
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hoglet
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Re: Matchbox co-processor new users

Post by hoglet » Mon Feb 29, 2016 11:51 am

sweh wrote:
hoglet wrote: Do you own, or have access to, one of these?
http://www.stardot.org.uk/forums/viewto ... 20#p100220
I have a Wiggler style JTAG programmer which I last used in 2014 to rescue a Seagate Dockstar (a "pogoplug" device) after I messed up flashing Debian to it. It's in the basement somewhere :-)
I'd love to be proved wrong, but I don't think generic JTAG interfaces are recognised by the Xilinx programming software.

Dave

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Re: Matchbox co-processor new users

Post by danielj » Mon Feb 29, 2016 3:11 pm

If anyone attending Wakefield wants to re-flash their co-pro, let me know in advance and I'll bring the bits.

d.

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Re: Matchbox co-processor new users

Post by flynnjs » Mon Feb 29, 2016 8:44 pm

fordp wrote:What happened to Jason's Interface?
I've got a bunch of PCBs here, I need to solder a few up.

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Re: Matchbox co-processor new users

Post by grannyg » Tue Mar 01, 2016 12:57 am

I found this link useful for setting up Xilinx ISE and the required cable driver on Linux. http://www.george-smart.co.uk/wiki/Xilinx_JTAG_Linux

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Re: Matchbox co-processor new users

Post by sweh » Tue Mar 01, 2016 1:21 am

hoglet wrote: I'd love to be proved wrong, but I don't think generic JTAG interfaces are recognised by the Xilinx programming software.
Apparently my board can be made to be a "Xilinx Buffered Parallel Cable III"

http://www.tiaowiki.com/w/Config_TIAO_U ... _Cable_III

(Hmm, this page just says "force type"... http://www.tiaowiki.com/w/Program_Xilin ... JTAG_Cable )

I've no idea if that'd work with the matchbox copro...
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Re: Matchbox co-processor new users

Post by hoglet » Tue Mar 01, 2016 7:11 am

sweh wrote:
hoglet wrote: I'd love to be proved wrong, but I don't think generic JTAG interfaces are recognised by the Xilinx programming software.
Apparently my board can be made to be a "Xilinx Buffered Parallel Cable III"

http://www.tiaowiki.com/w/Config_TIAO_U ... _Cable_III

(Hmm, this page just says "force type"... http://www.tiaowiki.com/w/Program_Xilin ... JTAG_Cable )

I've no idea if that'd work with the matchbox copro...
I think you need a much older version of the Xilinx tools - ISE 10.1 if I remember correctly - to support the Parallel Cable. But support for the Spartan-6 family (used by the Matchbox LX9) only came in with ISE 11.1. It's just possible, if you only want to use the programmer, that it would work, but I somehow doubt it.

The other option to explore is a Virtual Cable. Have a search for "xvcd" or "xilinx virtual cable daemon". There's some more info here:
http://debugmo.de/2012/02/xvcd-the-xili ... le-daemon/
and
https://hackaday.io/project/4262-cheap- ... lternative

Dave

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Re: Matchbox co-processor new users

Post by danielj » Tue Mar 01, 2016 9:44 am

Dave, are you happy for more pages to be added to the Wiki? e.g. Operating systems/software/instructions on a "per core" basis?

d.

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Re: Matchbox co-processor new users

Post by hoglet » Tue Mar 01, 2016 10:22 am

danielj wrote:Dave, are you happy for more pages to be added to the Wiki? e.g. Operating systems/software/instructions on a "per core" basis?
Very happy!

The more pages the better....

Dave

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Re: Matchbox co-processor new users

Post by PhilYoung » Wed Mar 02, 2016 11:32 am

hoglet wrote: I think you need a much older version of the Xilinx tools - ISE 10.1 if I remember correctly - to support the Parallel Cable. But support for the Spartan-6 family (used by the Matchbox LX9) only came in with ISE 11.1. It's just possible, if you only want to use the programmer, that it would work, but I somehow doubt it.

Dave
Hi,

I've had no problems using ISE 14.something with the parallel programmer - albeit for the GODIL rather than the matchbox co-pro. I think 'unsupported' here means 'if it doesn't work we don't care' rather than 'removed', so it should be OK.

You can also (I think) compile using a later ISE and then use Impact from 10.1 to upload, can't remember if I did this or not at one stage,

Cheers,

Phil Young

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Re: Matchbox co-processor new users

Post by hoglet » Wed Mar 02, 2016 2:09 pm

PhilYoung wrote: I've had no problems using ISE 14.something with the parallel programmer - albeit for the GODIL rather than the matchbox co-pro. I think 'unsupported' here means 'if it doesn't work we don't care' rather than 'removed', so it should be OK.
That's interesting....

And your cable is definitely a "Parallel Cable III" not a "Parallel Cable IV"?

Dave

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Re: Matchbox co-processor new users

Post by PhilYoung » Wed Mar 02, 2016 5:21 pm

hoglet wrote:
PhilYoung wrote: I've had no problems using ISE 14.something with the parallel programmer - albeit for the GODIL rather than the matchbox co-pro. I think 'unsupported' here means 'if it doesn't work we don't care' rather than 'removed', so it should be OK.
That's interesting....

And your cable is definitely a "Parallel Cable III" not a "Parallel Cable IV"?

Dave
There are two parallel programmers that I've used. One is the GODIL specific parallel programmer which is a clone of the Parallel cable III (basically a level shifter on the relevant pins so that the FPGA side runs at 3.3V and the PC side at 5V). The other is an ebay cheapie that came with a mini CPLD board which is another direct copy of the original Xilinx programmer.

I know it works because spent a lot of time messing about with the mini board since it seemed to be faulty (turned out that it was the 5v PSU at fault). I initially using ISE14.1 (IIRC - 14.something anyway), then 10.1 because it officially supported the Parallel programmer and I though that the problem lay with the device programming side. On discovering that it was a dud PSU, I got it working with 10.1 and then went back to 14.1 just to see if that worked - which it did. I subsequently used 14.1 to program my GODIL.

I did have to have a couple of goes to program the GODIL though, so maybe not 100% reliable. Unless it was finger trouble. But you'll know if it's worked when the checksums match on 'Verify'.

Cheers,

Phil Young

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Re: Matchbox co-processor new users

Post by fordp » Sun Mar 27, 2016 1:28 pm

I guess I qualify as a new user here.

I finally got round to ordering an extension cable so I could plug my second Matchbox LX9 in to my Master (My first is on my BBC B).

Well it does not work it tries to boot but I get lots of extra characters coming up and different on every "break".

Here is a video showing it:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jDaYEvZCujc

I will look in to it further, but any advice?
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Re: Matchbox co-processor new users

Post by hoglet » Sun Mar 27, 2016 2:16 pm

fordp wrote: I will look in to it further, but any advice?
Can you post a picture of your extension cable? How long is it?

Couple of things to try:

Does the extension cable work on the Model B?

Do both Matchbox LX9's behave the same way on the Master?

Dave

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Re: Matchbox co-processor new users

Post by fordp » Sun Mar 27, 2016 3:08 pm

My cable is 200mm http://cpc.farnell.com/pro-signal/psg-4 ... EML007-004

I have not tried it on the Beeb yet but I can.

It is a shame all the connections on the 40 way connector are on the bottom row of I could connect my logic analyser.

The only easy connections on the Matchbox LX9 are 0V and 5V :(

I had a probe with my scope and the only very rounded off lines was the IRQ which I do not think is even used on the CoPro?
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Re: Matchbox co-processor new users

Post by fordp » Sun Mar 27, 2016 3:28 pm

I have tried both of my Matchbox LX9's and they both work on the cable on my BBC B and neither work on my Master.
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Re: Matchbox co-processor new users

Post by hoglet » Sun Mar 27, 2016 3:34 pm

fordp wrote:I have tried both of my Matchbox LX9's and they both work on the cable on my BBC B and neither work on my Master.
It's probably worth trying to give the tube connector on the Master a good clean (e.g. by plugging/unplugging the cable about 10 times).

Is there anything else unusual about the Master?

Is anything connected to the 1MHz bus?

Dave
Last edited by hoglet on Sun Mar 27, 2016 3:41 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Matchbox co-processor new users

Post by fordp » Sun Mar 27, 2016 3:40 pm

My master is pretty standard. It had a genlock board when I got it in the first place, my brother removed it for me and put it back to standard spec many moons ago. Maybe it was a Domesday machine at some point as I think they had a genlock board???

I have an IFEL board in the slot (http://www.retro-kit.co.uk/page.cfm/con ... BC-Master/)

I have a very old IFEL MMC/SD Card reader.
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Re: Matchbox co-processor new users

Post by hoglet » Sun Mar 27, 2016 3:42 pm

SteveF had a similar problem (Master, producing garbled text):
http://www.stardot.org.uk/forums/viewto ... 16#p127755

Cleaning the tube connector on the Master resolved this I believe:
http://www.stardot.org.uk/forums/viewto ... 16#p127780

Dave

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Re: Matchbox co-processor new users

Post by fordp » Sun Mar 27, 2016 5:28 pm

I finally made something work :)
14590996433122095762746.jpg
This is Dave/ Udo's FPGA version of the 32016.

Still only on my BBC B, but I managed to fashion a connector solder it on, fight tooth and nail with impact which must have crashed 20 times or more.

My first BBC has hosted BAS32 for the first time in over 20 years :D
Last edited by fordp on Sun Mar 27, 2016 5:33 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Matchbox co-processor new users

Post by hoglet » Sun Mar 27, 2016 5:30 pm

fordp wrote:I finally made something work :)
14590996433122095762746.jpg
Is that the 32016 on the Pi?

You missed that bit out of the photo :D

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Re: Matchbox co-processor new users

Post by fordp » Sun Mar 27, 2016 5:34 pm

If you look at the figures Dave you can tell some are too fast and some too slow for the Bas32f Pi version ;)
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Re: Matchbox co-processor new users

Post by fordp » Sun Mar 27, 2016 8:18 pm

A little programming I am working on:
1459109847835-1153855297.jpg
Needs some double height and colours I think but it works so far.

It just issues the equivalent to the *FX command. I will add it to run from auto-boot.

Maybe a bit of machine language running in the host can load basic?
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Re: Matchbox co-processor new users

Post by Zaphod » Tue Mar 29, 2016 10:30 am

fordp wrote:My master is pretty standard. It had a genlock board when I got it in the first place, my brother removed it for me and put it back to standard spec many moons ago. Maybe it was a Domesday machine at some point as I think they had a genlock board???
No they didn't, the genlock is all in the VP415. An AIV master has an internal 65C102 co pro and SCSI, along with the VFS rom
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Re: Matchbox co-processor new users

Post by fordp » Tue Mar 29, 2016 11:39 am

Zaphod wrote:
fordp wrote:My master is pretty standard. It had a genlock board when I got it in the first place, my brother removed it for me and put it back to standard spec many moons ago. Maybe it was a Domesday machine at some point as I think they had a genlock board???
No they didn't, the genlock is all in the VP415. An AIV master has an internal 65C102 co pro and SCSI, along with the VFS rom
Thanks for that Zaphod,

I guess my Master must have been used for some TV/ Video work in the past.
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Re: Matchbox co-processor new users

Post by danielj » Tue Mar 29, 2016 12:13 pm

Didn't the SCSI board have a replacement clock circuit on it though? To work with the GenLock?

d.

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