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Flip! - Icon

Posted: Sun Dec 31, 2017 4:32 pm
by CMcDougall
Flip! - Icon

had this on tape BITD from a compilation
tried my tape to disc hack & STH disc
they both 'crash' after you match more four cards, sometimes 10....

when it crashes, the music just goes all funny and the pointer goes away :(

only game my youngest daughter plays for more than 1min :roll:

tried from just disc with all other roms off , same :evil:

Happy 2018 ! :D

Re: Flip! - Icon

Posted: Sun Dec 31, 2017 4:45 pm
by lurkio

Re: Flip! - Icon

Posted: Sun Dec 31, 2017 6:12 pm
by CMcDougall
^ It does same...

sometimes does it with just 2 cards matched...

works from my tape 'audiogenic' , says 'Icon' on STH

Re: Flip! - Icon

Posted: Sun Dec 31, 2017 7:20 pm
by Pernod
I used to really enjoy this game, so try the version from my disc viewtopic.php?f=32&t=5234&p=48289#p48287. If it doesn't work then must be a quirk with your setup.

Re: Flip! - Icon

Posted: Sun Dec 31, 2017 8:42 pm
by CMcDougall
^will give a go, cheers N (works further so far on All Emu's :wink: )
lurkio wrote:Have you tried this?
just tried both on emulator (BeebEm414 1770 2.26DFS &bEm22) before putting to MMC card, to try on that, then actual disc.
both fail in Emu :shock:
I did see Bad Program wizz round before it went away, and REPORT & P.ERL shows nothing on Aud/ReR :?
on Icon version shows Disc Err18 at line10

my tape rip was from the 'Complete BBC - Audiogenic" : viewtopic.php?f=32&t=5023#p66848

what is it with Icon & Audiogenic games lately, being BugEyes :Starman V Zelda :roll:

Re: Flip! - Icon

Posted: Sun Dec 31, 2017 9:07 pm
by lurkio
lurkio wrote:Have you tried this?:
http://bbcmicro.co.uk/game.php?id=223
That works for me in Windows BeebEm 4.14 in Model B mode with DFS 1.20 (DNFS) and no other ROMs.

Also works in JSBeeb.

:idea:

Re: Flip! - Icon

Posted: Sun Dec 31, 2017 9:09 pm
by sweh
My copy from BITD is here: http://www.stardot.org.uk/forums/viewto ... lip#p46104 (IIRC, this is one I converted from tape to disc myself, but I could easily be misremembering).

It _seems_ to run in BeebEm, and in my real Beeb.

I remember, even back then, that this was one of those "sensitive" games. Sometimes would crash for no reason, other times would work perfectly. I found it more reliable when run from a cold-boot.

Re: Flip! - Icon

Posted: Sun Dec 31, 2017 9:16 pm
by CMcDougall
Pernod wrote:I used to really enjoy this game, so try the version from my disc .
just put it to it's own .SSD, fails to load if Shift-Break to !boot with */-.FLIP
but use */-.FLIP from Basic, it works :-k
sweh wrote:I remember, even back then, that this was one of those "sensitive" games. Sometimes would crash for no reason, other times would work perfectly. I found it more reliable when run from a cold-boot.
Spot on Stephen =D> , sounds about right here too, on BeebEm414

just done 20 matching cards (with Nigel's), then it 'haulted' [-( ](*,)
EDIT2: sweh, haults aswell :|

*maybe* needs a ?&800=&80 in the loader to do a 'cold-boot' like EagleEmpire game...
EDIT1... still does it :-s

below is a save state IF any use... :?:

Re: Flip! - Icon

Posted: Sun Dec 31, 2017 9:51 pm
by ctr
This is the conversion I did bitd. I was able to complete a game using beebem (and 46 tries :oops:).

Re: Flip! - Icon

Posted: Tue Jan 02, 2018 4:15 pm
by CMcDougall
ctr wrote:This is the conversion I did bitd
:^o it says 2011 CTR in the !Boot :-s
weird, it crashed on mine after 8 cards :x

maybe this never worked properly BITD 1985, and it was just a fluke that it 'sometimes' worked from tape :-k

Re: Flip! - Icon

Posted: Tue Jan 02, 2018 5:27 pm
by ctr
CMcDougall wrote:
ctr wrote:This is the conversion I did bitd
:^o it says 2011 CTR in the !Boot :-s
Caught red-handed! I did the disk conversion back in the 80s with multiple games per disk. In 2004 I transferred all the disks to ssd files and in 2011 I rearranged them with one ssd per game, but whatever butchery I did to the games themselves is unchanged. I used the same boot file for all the new ssds and that was new in 2011.

But back to Flip! I just played through another single player game and it worked fine though I've never tried a two player game. I don't know what's up.

Re: Flip! - Icon

Posted: Tue Jan 02, 2018 6:53 pm
by CMcDougall
^Maybe you have hit the nail on the head, as BITD (1986ish :wink: ) I always played with myself... :shock: :lol:

Recently after my daughter finished Grannys Garden 8) she then found Flip! , so have been using the two player version of it, & hence the music wonky freezing :x

So, maybe the single player is more reliable, so when it asks for 2nd name entry press Return (says practice at bottom) & that *should* make it work...

cheers!!

Re: Flip! - Icon

Posted: Wed Jan 03, 2018 11:05 pm
by CMcDougall
me wrote:maybe the single player is more reliable
still fails :-&

Re: Flip! - Icon

Posted: Thu Jan 04, 2018 6:54 am
by vanekp
Odd as as I played it the other day to completion on Beebem with no problems, it was with the tape version of the game.

Re: Flip! - Icon

Posted: Thu Jan 04, 2018 1:01 pm
by ctr
CMcDougall wrote:just tried both on emulator (BeebEm414 1770 2.26DFS &bEm22)
I hadn't noticed this detail previously. I'm using beebem with the 8271 and DFS 1.20.

Re: Flip! - Icon

Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 2:31 pm
by CMcDougall
my daughter had another go today, straight on from cold switch on,
using one player, & when two match, use full length of guess, ie "ABCDE" not just "Z"
and, she completed it :D

Re: Flip! - Icon

Posted: Mon Jan 22, 2018 4:50 pm
by Michael Brown
Ran my copy of Flip, the Icon original from Disc013.
Ran the game from cold start.
Had no extra chips like Disc Doctor or Exmon II running.

Set it up for 1 player game with normal and user words.
Selected a 1 letter word "M".
Went to guess wrong on purpose and put in "A" on its own and it crashed.
Found that it was OK if you guess a single letter word right, but crashed if your guess was a single letter word and was wrong.

Found that you can press ESCAPE and start again.

I had a brief look through the code and I could not find any obvious routines to break the game.

I did run it under BeebEm14 with DFS1.20
Also loaded the Audiogenic tape copy in from cold and the same thing happened there too.

Anyone else got any ideas?

Mick.

Re: Flip! - Icon

Posted: Tue Jan 23, 2018 6:43 pm
by Michael Brown
Using Exmon II, found the following

In 1 player mode...
Typing the word as WORDA
this gets stored at &45 and &4F
the &45 word gets scrambled if you select scrambled.

In 2 player mode...
Typing word1 as WORDA
this gets stored at &4A and &54
the &4A word gets scrambled if you select that option.
and word2 as LINEB
this gets stored at &45 and &4F
the &45 word gets scrambled if you select that option.

One interesting thing here is that the 1 player word gets stored at &45 and &4F, but gets stored at &4A &4B in 2 player mode.

Also if you type a single letter word such as "A", then it is stored at &45 and &4F etc followed by four &20s for the four blank spaces, so that doesn't look like it is causing any problem as that seems the correct thing to do.

I will look again soon.
Mick.

Re: Flip! - Icon

Posted: Wed Jan 24, 2018 9:19 am
by Michael Brown
Taken another look today.
This time under Bem, just in case it was a emulator thing.
However, in 1 player mode and using a word with just 1 letter, it crashed.
It also crashed under 1 letter with scrambled selected as well.

Reloaded BeebEm and Exmon II.

In the FLIP2 file after downloading I found the following code...

A96 LDX#&04
A98 LDA&4F,X
A9A STA&54,X
A9C LDA&45,X
A9E STA&4A,X

It looks like this may be what moved the text (from player 1 mode) at &45 (scrambled) and &4F to &4A (scrambled) and &54 (where it is stored in 2 player mode).

Also found code...

B10 LDX#&04
B12 LDA&3C,X
B14 STA&4F,X

The guessed word is stored at &3C when inputted.

Also your names are stored at...
&1795 (player 1's name)
&179D (player 2's name)

Also...
code for "NO WAY SUCKER" at &1735
code for "OK PUNK" at &1749

Anyone else want to have a look?