No more leaded solder

Talk about non-Acorn classic computers/hardware/software here (including retro consoles)
Prime
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Re: No more leaded solder

Post by Prime » Thu Mar 08, 2018 5:59 pm

Well 2x500g reels arrived from Rapid today, so looks like it's possibly just RS being over-zelous.

Should keep me going for the next 5 years or so.

Cheers.

Phill.

crj
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Re: No more leaded solder

Post by crj » Thu Mar 08, 2018 6:29 pm

Diminished wrote:Paradoxically, it seems like the chief effect of this ban on the denizens of this forum was ... a large uptick in sales of leaded solder. :lol:
Mmm. It's probably not smart viral marketing on RS's part, but I'd be impressed if it were. (-8

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richardtoohey
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Re: No more leaded solder

Post by richardtoohey » Fri Mar 09, 2018 4:49 am

Prime wrote:Being perdantic,
Ummm ... :-# O:)

Prime
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Re: No more leaded solder

Post by Prime » Fri Mar 09, 2018 8:55 am

richardtoohey wrote:
Prime wrote:Being perdantic,
Ummm ... :-# O:)
Oops typo :)

Cheers.

Phill.

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sbadger
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Re: No more leaded solder

Post by sbadger » Wed Mar 14, 2018 10:04 am

Thanks for the heads up, half a kilo arrived this morning, based on how much I use should keep me going indefinitely. I pretty much only repair old stuff that will already be lead-based.

I thought I best get some before the respectable retailers get their acts together. Though I suspect china will keep selling it on ebay etc... but if I’m being cynical, lead metal is probably not the only thing to worry about in that stuff.
So many projects, so little time...

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danielj
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Re: No more leaded solder

Post by danielj » Wed Mar 14, 2018 12:04 pm

CPC came up with the goods...

d.

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tricky
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Re: No more leaded solder

Post by tricky » Wed Mar 14, 2018 12:52 pm

For making new add-ons, how bad is lead free?

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Re: No more leaded solder

Post by Prime » Wed Mar 14, 2018 1:29 pm

tricky wrote:For making new add-ons, how bad is lead free?
The consensous of opinion** seems to be that it is harder to work with for hand soldering, because it requires higher temperature to melt, it isn't a eutectic mixture so the component metals *DONT* freeze at the same tempereture, which can lead to stresses as solder is solidifying leading to a bad joint. Also it's hard to tell if a joint is 'dry' just by looking at it.

**The couple of times I have tried using lead free I have found these to be true.

Plus there is the Tin whiskers problem which seems to be more prevelant with Pb free solder. A lot of this of course is less significant for machine assembled boards.

Cheers.

Phill.

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1024MAK
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Re: No more leaded solder

Post by 1024MAK » Wed Mar 14, 2018 4:18 pm

tricky wrote:For making new add-ons, how bad is lead free?
It is strongly recommended that you use different soldering iron bits (or separate irons), and different tip cleaners. So that the lead based solder does not contaminate the lead free solder alloy.

It also requires the component legs/pins and the board to be very clean.

How easy it is to hand solder, also depends on which lead free solder alloy you use. Some type are better than others.

Mark
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tricky
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Re: No more leaded solder

Post by tricky » Wed Mar 14, 2018 6:22 pm

Thanks guys, that sounds a little worse than I was expecting.

crj
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Re: No more leaded solder

Post by crj » Wed Mar 14, 2018 7:27 pm

I intend to keep using lead for hand-soldering.

I gather leaded solder is still mandated for various military applications in the USA, so it's going to continue being available for a while. I don't personally do much soldering, but it's pretty clear I urgently need to pick up a reel of thin stuff to go with the thicker reel I've been working my way through over the decades.

Given I grew up in London breathing the fumes from leaded petrol, playing with toys that had lead-based paint and later indulging in D&D with literal lead figures, I'm not sure I have much to fear from a few grams of lead solder in a well-ventilated area once in a while. I might even remember to wash my hands afterwards. (-8

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1024MAK
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Re: No more leaded solder

Post by 1024MAK » Wed Mar 14, 2018 10:16 pm

crj wrote:I intend to keep using lead for hand-soldering.

I gather leaded solder is still mandated for various military applications in the USA, so it's going to continue being available for a while. I don't personally do much soldering, but it's pretty clear I urgently need to pick up a reel of thin stuff to go with the thicker reel I've been working my way through over the decades.

Given I grew up in London breathing the fumes from leaded petrol, playing with toys that had lead-based paint and later indulging in D&D with literal lead figures, I'm not sure I have much to fear from a few grams of lead solder in a well-ventilated area once in a while. I might even remember to wash my hands afterwards. (-8
Don't forget to only use water supplied via lead pipe work :lol:

Mark
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tricky
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Re: No more leaded solder

Post by tricky » Wed Mar 14, 2018 11:27 pm

My grandfather's butcher's shop had lead pipes and the best tasting water ever!

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Re: No more leaded solder

Post by crj » Thu Mar 15, 2018 12:20 am

1024MAK wrote:Don't forget to only use water supplied via lead pipe work :lol:
Now you mention it, pipes were soldered with lead-based solder too. Also, there was a segment of lead pipe to the wash basin upstairs until my parents had the bathroom re-done. That's probably OK; it's not as though we brushed our teeth using that water, or anything. /-8

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1024MAK
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Re: No more leaded solder

Post by 1024MAK » Thu Mar 15, 2018 8:32 pm

crj wrote:
1024MAK wrote:Don't forget to only use water supplied via lead pipe work :lol:
Now you mention it, pipes were soldered with lead-based solder too. Also, there was a segment of lead pipe to the wash basin upstairs until my parents had the bathroom re-done. That's probably OK; it's not as though we brushed our teeth using that water, or anything. /-8
In the first house that my parents bought, where I grew up, the mains supply pipe into the kitchen was a lead pipe...

In one of the messroms at one of the work locations where I sometimes worked in 1988 to 1989, the mains water supply was via a lead pipe...

Mark
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danielj
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Re: No more leaded solder

Post by danielj » Thu Mar 15, 2018 9:57 pm

Most of the mains supplies on my road are lead pipes still!

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vanpeebles
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Re: No more leaded solder

Post by vanpeebles » Fri Mar 16, 2018 1:12 pm

Everyone should have paid attention to my Hakko url link, that explains lead pipes too!

Hikaru
What?! That is terribly dangerous, isn't it?

Mr.Yokoo
No, it is not always dangerous. When lead is combined with carbonic acid and oxygen dissolved in water, a film of lead compound (2PbCO3・Pb(OH)2) is deposited on the inner surface of the lead pipe. Because this compound is not soluble in water, it prevents lead from dissolving into the water. Tap water was clean in the past.

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Re: No more leaded solder

Post by crj » Fri Mar 16, 2018 6:30 pm

The pages I glanced at suggested there was some risk. I suspect this is because lead piping isn't smooth, and in any case the protective layer would be fragile whenever pipes were knocked, even by water hammer effects. Advice was to be gentle with the pipes, drink water only from the kitchen tap and flush the loo then run the tap each morning to get rid of the water that had accumulated lead overnight.

Or, of course, to change your pipes!

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sbadger
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Re: No more leaded solder

Post by sbadger » Thu May 17, 2018 9:28 am

I've finally got around to doing some soldering with my young lad, though it turns out he hates the smell, so much so it's putting him off.
Can anyone recommend an odour free solder? (lead free is fine also in this instance - he's not going anywhere near the good stuff!)
So many projects, so little time...

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Elminster
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Re: No more leaded solder

Post by Elminster » Thu May 17, 2018 11:57 am

It is usually the flux that smells rather than the hot metals bits.

Do you have a fume extractor or a large blower. They do make a difference, my Aoyue iron has built in extracotr, just dumps the fumes a few feet from me, but makes a huge difference, I know becuase it is blocked at the moment so I have fumes in my face again till I clear it.

Edit: I should also admit to being one of them weirdo's that uses lead free solder (+silver), I only use lead for repairing retro stuff, i.e. like for like. Never have a problem soldering, much harder to desolder though, but the ones with added silver (SAC305 with 3% ag) is much better (I wouldnt go back to using the cheaper unleaded that doesnt have silver). Also it is useful if attaked by wearwolves while soldering. And the string of garlic keeps off the vampires.

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sbadger
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Re: No more leaded solder

Post by sbadger » Thu May 17, 2018 12:46 pm

Elminster wrote:It is usually the flux that smells rather than the hot metals bits.

Do you have a fume extractor or a large blower.
lol, no, just a kitchen table, but you make a good point about flux. I'll try a different type of flux core
So many projects, so little time...

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Re: No more leaded solder

Post by guesser » Thu May 17, 2018 4:22 pm

Got an old PC case fan that you can run up with 6 or 7 volts off a bench supply?
I find having one stood upright just ticking over on the table behind what I'm soldering makes plenty of airflow to keep the flux out of my face if I'm doing going to be a lot.

Exhuming the power supply from under the pending projects is a hassle so if I'm just fixing a couple of connectors or something I'll just blow on it of course :lol:
A web based teletext editor which can export as Mode 7 screen memory: https://zxnet.co.uk/teletext/editor

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