new to atom: ram rom mmc joystick power

discussion of games, software, hardware & emulators relating to the Acorn Atom
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tricky
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new to atom: ram rom mmc joystick power

Post by tricky » Sun Jul 08, 2018 11:10 am

I am another new atom guardian.
I sort of ordered a ram/ROM board at abug south, I think from prime, but as I can't remember names or faces I'm not sure who it was.

I would like an AtoMMC kit, but built is fine. I think they are hoglet's, but not sure if anyone sells them.

I would also like to know if there is a standard wiring for joysticks?

I am thinking of making up a dual Sega adapter like I made for the beeb/master.

With 0v, 5v and 6 IO pins you could support a two button (or use 2 off 6) Sega controller.
With 7 IO pins you could support all 6 buttons.
With 7 and a couple of ls157s you could have two controllers with 2 buttons.
8 + 157s could be 2 controllers with 6 buttons each.
8 + 6 157s would support 4 controllers with 2 buttons each.

The above would also work for Atari, but they would only have 1 button and require resistors if the IO pins don't have pull-up/downs.

If there is a standard, I would like to be compatible.
Last edited by tricky on Thu Jul 19, 2018 6:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Elminster
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Re: new to atom: ram rom mmc joystick

Post by Elminster » Sun Jul 08, 2018 11:21 am

Hopefully on my hardware list in link in signature. If things are missing let me know and I will add them. Not having an Atom some of that hardware misses me.

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danielj
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Re: new to atom: ram rom mmc joystick

Post by danielj » Sun Jul 08, 2018 11:28 am

SirMorris (Charlie) for the AtomMMC. Prime for the RAM/ROM :)

d.

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1024MAK
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Re: new to atom: ram rom mmc joystick

Post by 1024MAK » Sun Jul 08, 2018 11:39 am

RAM/ROM boards are from Prime (Phill)

AtoMMC kits (built but requires installation) are supplied by SirMorris (Charlie). PM him :wink:

Ahh, I see Daniel got in before me. Well at least you know I was not editing this while driving...

Mark
Last edited by 1024MAK on Sun Jul 08, 2018 4:22 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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tricky
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Re: new to atom: ram rom mmc joystick

Post by tricky » Sun Jul 08, 2018 11:56 am

Messages sent to sirmorris (via email) and prime (private message).

Does anyone have any thoughts about joysticks?

I'm thinking two buttons are plenty, but also I don't know of anything needing four controllers.

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oss003
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Re: new to atom: ram rom mmc joystick

Post by oss003 » Sun Jul 08, 2018 12:17 pm

Hi Tricky,

in all my games, I use this digital joystick configuration:
The joystick is connected to User Port of the AtoMMC interface and wired like this:

Code: Select all

AtoMMC  Joystick
-----------------
 PB0  -  Right
 PB1  -  Left
 PB2  -  Down
 PB3  -  Up
 PB4  -  Fire
 PB5  -  nc
 PB6  -  nc
 PB7  -  nc

 GND  -  GND
This can be expanded for more buttons of course.
For now, it only supports 1 joystick.
Just one remark: GND is not supported on User Port pin header so has to be connected manually.
I don't know if Charlie changed this for the newer boards .....

Userport.png

I also found some interesting stuff about a multiplayer gaming network for the C64 with 2x 6522 ....
The original Italian article and a Google translate article are attached.

Greetings
Kees
Attachments
Commodore 64 game network-it.pdf
(538.99 KiB) Downloaded 4 times
Commodore 64 game network-uk.pdf
(796.78 KiB) Downloaded 9 times
Last edited by oss003 on Sun Jul 08, 2018 2:02 pm, edited 10 times in total.

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tricky
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Re: new to atom: ram rom mmc joystick

Post by tricky » Sun Jul 08, 2018 2:30 pm

Thanks Kees, that was the sort of thing I was hoping for.
I'm being a bit lazy; do you set the other bits as input or output and if out what do you set then to?
I was expecting to have to pick up GND separately and 5V for the Sega controllers.
I won't be doing anything until I get my AtoMMC anyway, but I would be interested in any thoughts you have about number of fire buttons and number of controllers.

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Re: new to atom: ram rom mmc joystick

Post by oss003 » Sun Jul 08, 2018 3:09 pm

I set all bits to input, this is my joystick routine:

Code: Select all

;----------------------------------------------------------
; Set PORTB direction
;----------------------------------------------------------

joyinit:
	lda #$ff   ; Write value to latch, bits 0-7 input
	sta $b401
	jsr interwritedelay
	lda #$a1   ; Write direction in latch to PORTB
	sta $b400
wait_until_not_busy:
	lda $b400
	bmi wait_until_not_busy
	rts

;----------------------------------------------------------
; Get PORTB value
;----------------------------------------------------------

joyget:
	lda #$a2   ; Read value PORTB in latch
	sta $b400
	jsr interwritedelay
	lda $b401
	beq no_joystick
	eor #$ff
	and #$1f
no_joystick:
	rts

;----------------------------------------------------------
; Short delay
;
; Enough to intersperse 2 writes to the FATPIC.
;----------------------------------------------------------

interwritedelay:
	lda  #8
	sec
loop:
	sbc  #1
	bne  loop
	rts
Greetings
Kees

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Re: new to atom: ram rom mmc joystick

Post by oss003 » Sun Jul 08, 2018 3:54 pm

For the Atom, there are only a few 2 player games and there is a Dutch User Group 2 joystick solution.
Solder the joystick wires parallel to the top 2 rows of the keyboard matrix.

Maybe a second button could be added but I don't know if there's any need for more buttons.

Didn't know you had an Atom Tricky, looking for a new challenge? ..... ;)

Greetings
Kees

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tricky
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Re: new to atom: ram rom mmc joystick

Post by tricky » Sun Jul 08, 2018 4:35 pm

I am trying to avoid any more challenges at the moment ;) It is quite tempting though.
I am planning to take the atom to the shows that I do and want it to show its best side, although I'm sticking with composite for now.

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Re: new to atom: ram rom mmc joystick

Post by IanS » Sun Jul 08, 2018 4:43 pm

oss003 wrote:
Sun Jul 08, 2018 3:09 pm
I set all bits to input
Can you configure a couple of pins as outputs? So you you could use two outputs as column outputs and have a 2x6 matrix of switches for up/down/left/right/fire1/fire2 for 2 players. Probably need some diodes to avoid gosting effects.

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Re: new to atom: ram rom mmc joystick

Post by oss003 » Sun Jul 08, 2018 5:18 pm

IanS wrote:
Sun Jul 08, 2018 4:43 pm
oss003 wrote:
Sun Jul 08, 2018 3:09 pm
I set all bits to input
Can you configure a couple of pins as outputs? So you you could use two outputs as column outputs and have a 2x6 matrix of switches for up/down/left/right/fire1/fire2 for 2 players. Probably need some diodes to avoid gosting effects.
Nice idea to create a matrix ..... =D>
Yes, every bit can be set as input or output, just like the VIA.
Or use a 74LS157 demultiplexer to create a 6x4 matrix for 4 joysticks.

Greetings
Kees
Last edited by oss003 on Sun Jul 08, 2018 5:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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tricky
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Re: new to atom: ram rom mmc joystick

Post by tricky » Sat Jul 14, 2018 3:16 pm

AtomMmc arrived today, had to bodge a power connector (which hasn't arrived yet) as I couldn't wait to try it.
AtomMmc.jpg
Was the original idea to solder it to the connector instead of the ribbon cable?
I'm trying to find a good place to mount it, current options are:
  • Leave it internal attached to its main board.
  • Attach it to the back, so the top of the card is just visible at the back of the Atom.
  • Try to make a bracket so that the card pokes out through the power/AV hole (composite goes through RF socket).
Just need to find out how to contact Prime.
Last edited by tricky on Sat Jul 14, 2018 3:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: new to atom: ram rom mmc joystick

Post by 1024MAK » Sat Jul 14, 2018 5:16 pm

Phill (Prime) is a regular here, so PM him. Alternatively he is on Facebook.

Mark
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Re: new to atom: ram rom mmc joystick

Post by oss003 » Sat Jul 14, 2018 8:13 pm

Normally the AtoMMC is suppled with a flatcable between PL4 and the AtoMMC interface.
Another flatcable is used to connect the AtoMMC interface with the SD board which hangs outside the Atom.

Wim did solder a female connector to the AtoMMC board to install the AtoMMC interface directly on PL4.
The coloured flatcable is a joystick cable with on the other end a 9=pin D-connector.

Greetings
Kees
Attachments
MMC4.jpg
MMC3.jpg
MMC2.jpg
MMC1.jpg
Last edited by oss003 on Sat Jul 14, 2018 8:17 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: new to atom: ram rom mmc joystick

Post by Multiwizard » Sat Jul 14, 2018 9:32 pm

Indeed I did, in several Atoms... :D
Last edited by Multiwizard on Sat Jul 14, 2018 9:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: new to atom: ram rom mmc joystick

Post by sirmorris » Sun Jul 15, 2018 9:25 am

I have to admit that I didn't consider mounting on top like the econet board - I always just imagined popping the main interface board underneath the atom motherboard with the slot card hanging outside. I didn't think there was room on top as it's pretty cosy there under the lid. I was wary of shorting things out. That said, the prototype fitted there - it copied the form of the econet card.

I could offer this as a mounting option I guess..

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Re: new to atom: ram rom mmc joystick

Post by Multiwizard » Sun Jul 15, 2018 9:50 am

oss003 wrote:
Sat Jul 14, 2018 8:13 pm
Wim did solder a female connector to the AtoMMC board to install the AtoMMC interface directly on PL4.

Greetings
Kees
Hi Kees,

I was just checking the Atoms which I did this way.

The pics you showed the AtoMMC2 is soldered directly onto the Atom PCB with headers:

viewtopic.php?f=44&t=10262&p=149256&hil ... go#p123461

The version you meant are a little lower in that topic from my AtoMMC2go version:

viewtopic.php?f=44&t=10262&p=149256&hil ... go#p149255

Which do not fit underneath the top lid of the Atom.


Greetings, Wim... :-)
Last edited by Multiwizard on Sun Jul 15, 2018 9:51 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: new to atom: ram rom mmc joystick power

Post by tricky » Thu Jul 19, 2018 6:27 pm

My power sockets arrived today, so I trimmed one a little and hot glued it in my ATOM to see if it is OK.
My cunning plan it to mount the MMC sticking out through where the video and power would have been (composite is through RF connector).
At first, it didn't work, which turned out to be that only one side of the board is connected to the power and I had soldered to the other (through holes don't seem to be plated).
Attachments
power_out.jpg
power_in.jpg

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Re: new to atom: ram rom mmc joystick power

Post by oss003 » Thu Jul 19, 2018 8:01 pm

Great ..... here's a MMC joystick test program.
Just unpack it on the SD card and type *JOYTEST

Greetings
Kees
Attachments
JOYTEST.zip
(221 Bytes) Downloaded 7 times

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Re: new to atom: ram rom mmc joystick power

Post by Prime » Fri Jul 20, 2018 6:33 am

Just a small update,

I have a pair of Atom RAMROMs assembled, just need to get the cpld programmed, and board tested, will hopefully do that over the weekend. So hopefully you (and markdryan) should get a pm from me next week.....

Cheers.

Phill.

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Re: new to atom: ram rom mmc joystick power

Post by DutchAcorn » Fri Jul 20, 2018 7:36 am

tricky wrote:
Thu Jul 19, 2018 6:27 pm
My power sockets arrived today, so I trimmed one a little and hot glued it in my ATOM to see if it is OK. ....
Too late for you I guess, but anyone needing a power connector plug that fits the original socket, just drop me a PM, I have a few spares.
Paul

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tricky
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Re: new to atom: ram rom mmc joystick power

Post by tricky » Fri Jul 20, 2018 9:28 am

Thanks oss003,
that will make checking easier.

Thanks Prime,
does it come ready for the MMC board or do I need to program some EPROMS?
Is there a list of which chips I can remove to reduce power? (assuming it is recommended).

Thanks DutchAcorn,
mine had been converted to 5V and didn't come with a PSU or connector, so I got connectors that fitted the most appropriate supply I could find ;)

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Re: new to atom: ram rom mmc joystick power

Post by tricky » Sun Sep 23, 2018 2:02 pm

I've still not got around to doing anything with my Atom, but my current plans for the joystick are:

AtoMMC Joystick
-----------------
PB0 - Right
PB1 - Left
PB2 - Down
PB3 - Up
PB4 - Fire
PB5 - Fire 2 (could be 2nd, joy 2's fire or switchable as per my beeb SEGA adapters)
PB6 - Fire select out (this would connect to the SEGA pad to select between the two inputs sets UDLRAB/CXYZStSel IIRC)
PB7 - Joy select out (connects to a 74ls157 to swap PB0..3 to a second joystick)

I haven't looked at the correct selection of pull-ups/downs, but the levels of PB6/7 set as inputs should make the rest work as default first joystick, primary buttons.

I probably have to write a game to use this before going any further, but that may be quite a while!

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