Floppy switch configs

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AndyF
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Floppy switch configs

Post by AndyF » Tue Oct 24, 2017 2:12 pm

This may or more likely may not be of any use however I felt it was well worth posting here as hopefully it might be of some use. :?:

IIRC it was intended for the Oric platform when choosing drives but I could be wrong, as I say it may be of some interest...
floppy.switch.configurations.pdf
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:mrgreen:

Kazzie
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Re: Floppy switch configs

Post by Kazzie » Tue Oct 24, 2017 2:43 pm

I've been reading a counterpart document for 5 1/4" floppy drives. I'll post that one here, too, for reference.
5.25-jumpers.pdf
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Pudsey - BBC Model B 32k issue 7, Sidewise ROM board with 16K RAM
Archimedes 420/1 upgraded to 4MB RAM (mid- restoration)

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AndyF
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Re: Floppy switch configs

Post by AndyF » Tue Oct 24, 2017 3:04 pm

Kazzie wrote:I've been reading a counterpart document for 5 1/4" floppy drives. I'll post that one here, too, for reference.
That is quite handy to have too, thank you. :)

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Re: Floppy switch configs

Post by JannievanZyl » Sun Dec 31, 2017 1:09 am

Is there a guide on how to configure a “PC” drive such as a 360KB, 40-track unit to work with a BBC Model B with the standard 8271 setup?

I’ve searched the forum quite extensively, even read the whole high density thread. :D

Is it just a matter of changing the spindle speed to 300RPM or are there other setting I need to make?

And similar question for an 80-track drive?

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danielj
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Re: Floppy switch configs

Post by danielj » Sun Dec 31, 2017 7:27 am

It completely depends on the drive - the only constant thing to note is that the BBC doesn't expect a twist in the cable, and needs the first drive set as 0 (not 1 as on the pc) :?
Spindle speed is only an issue on 1.2mb drives.
d.

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Re: Floppy switch configs

Post by JannievanZyl » Sun Dec 31, 2017 7:33 am

Thanks Daniel,

So, just try a bunch?

Will a correctly configured 1.2 work as a BBC double sided, 80-track drive? Think that is 200KB per side?

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danielj
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Re: Floppy switch configs

Post by danielj » Sun Dec 31, 2017 8:38 am

It should do! I'm fairly sure some of the later beeb drives were appropriately configured 1.2mb units.

If there's no old media that you're trying to read and you're not fussed about being a purist, have you considered going the gotek/flash floppy route?

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Re: Floppy switch configs

Post by JannievanZyl » Sun Dec 31, 2017 10:32 am

danielj wrote:It should do! I'm fairly sure some of the later beeb drives were appropriately configured 1.2mb units.

If there's no old media that you're trying to read and you're not fussed about being a purist, have you considered going the gotek/flash floppy route?
A bit of both, actually.

I'm busy restoring around 100+ vintage computers (about 20 done so far) and like to;

1. Keep everything as original as possible. - purely for nostalgia's sake.
2. Adding a SD drive - for pure convenience.

I've just started with the BBCs, so it's also part of the learning about the machines.

Right now I'm still trying to find the DFS format commands, etc. I've got DFS 1.2 on one machine and 0.9 on another.

These are the systems I've restored/repaired so far this holiday.
Restored-2.jpg

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CMcDougall
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Re: Floppy switch configs

Post by CMcDougall » Sun Dec 31, 2017 10:54 am

^ poor Atom keys... :(
ImageImageImage

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Re: Floppy switch configs

Post by JannievanZyl » Sun Dec 31, 2017 11:36 am

CMcDougall wrote:^ poor Atom keys... :(
I'm pretty distraught about it.....

Keyboard was working perfectly and then I took it for a drive to try and find a 5mm DC plug. Went over a speedbump and heard the poor Atom bounce in the back of the car.

When I got home the Break key was broken. :x Rest of keys fine.

And a few days before this happened, I gave my other, perfectly restored Atom away........

If anyone can help with a spare key (just need the two springs), I'll be eternally grateful.

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Re: Floppy switch configs

Post by daveejhitchins » Sun Dec 31, 2017 11:51 am

JannievanZyl wrote:These are the systems I've restored/repaired so far this holiday.
Need a bigger table :shock: :lol:

Dave H :D
Parts: UM6502CE, GAL22V10D, GAL16V8D, AS6C62256A, TC514400AZ, WD1772, R6522, TMS27C512, AT28C256
Products: ARA II, ABR, ATI, AP6, MGC, AP5 . . .
For a price list, contact me at: Retro Hardware AT dave ej hitchins DOT plus DOT com

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Re: Floppy switch configs

Post by JannievanZyl » Sun Dec 31, 2017 12:08 pm

daveejhitchins wrote:
JannievanZyl wrote:These are the systems I've restored/repaired so far this holiday.
Need a bigger table :shock: :lol:

Dave H :D
It's a bloody crisis, I tell you..... :D

These are some of the machines waiting for their turn. Including a cupboard full of Acorn RISC systems.
To be restored.jpg
My next project after the BBCs is to first rebuild the stores and workshop. Would love to have at least 1 of each major system up and running to play with at will.

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Re: Floppy switch configs

Post by daveejhitchins » Sun Dec 31, 2017 1:32 pm

JannievanZyl wrote:It's a bloody crisis, I tell you..... :D
:shock:
Parts: UM6502CE, GAL22V10D, GAL16V8D, AS6C62256A, TC514400AZ, WD1772, R6522, TMS27C512, AT28C256
Products: ARA II, ABR, ATI, AP6, MGC, AP5 . . .
For a price list, contact me at: Retro Hardware AT dave ej hitchins DOT plus DOT com

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1024MAK
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Re: Floppy switch configs

Post by 1024MAK » Sun Dec 31, 2017 6:42 pm

That's rather a lot of machines...

What's the story?

Mark
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Re: Floppy switch configs

Post by jgharston » Sun Dec 31, 2017 7:42 pm

JannievanZyl wrote:Right now I'm still trying to find the DFS format commands, etc. I've got DFS 1.2 on one machine and 0.9 on another.
The DFS format commands are *FORM40 and *FORM80 and they are on the DFS utilities disk, or you can type in a short BASIC program:

Code: Select all

REM > FormDFS
REM Quick Formatter
DIM X% 31,data% 511:Y%=X%DIV256:*DISK
ON ERROR REPORT:PRINT " at line ";ERL:OSCLI"FX180,"+STR$(PAGE/256):END
*FX180,64
INPUT"Drive:  "drive%
INPUT"Tracks: "num%
FOR track%=0 TO num%-1
  PRINT CHR$13;"Track ";track%;
  FOR sector%=0 TO 9
    data%!(sector%*4)=track%
    data%?(sector%*4+2)=(sector%+track%*7)MOD10
    data%?(sector%*4+3)=1
  NEXT sector%
  X%?0=drive%
  X%!1=data%
  X%!5=&6305
  X%?7=track%
  X%!8=&10002A10
  A%=127:REPEAT:CALL&FFF1:UNTIL X%?12<>&10
  IF X%?12:PRINT" error &";~X%?12
NEXT track%:PRINT
FOR A%=0 TO 511 STEP 4:data%!A%=0:NEXT A%
data%?&107=num%*10
data%?&106=num%/25.6
X%?0=drive%
X%!1=data%
X%!5=&4B03
X%!9=&22
A%=127:REPEAT:CALL&FFF1:UNTIL X%?10<>&10
IF X%?10:PRINT"write error &";~X%?10
OSCLI"FX180,"+STR$(PAGE/256):END

Code: Select all

$ bbcbasic
PDP11 BBC BASIC IV Version 0.25
(C) Copyright J.G.Harston 1989,2005-2015
>_

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Re: Floppy switch configs

Post by JannievanZyl » Tue Jan 02, 2018 5:38 pm

1024MAK wrote:That's rather a lot of machines...

What's the story?

Mark
As with most of us here, I guess, got my first exposure to computers as a kid. For me it was around 1978 when I got a Compukit UK-101 (still looking for one).

It was the golden age of "home computing" when every man and his dog designed and put out a unique computer. So we read about all of them (extensively) without actually owning most of them.

Quite a while ago I decided to collect the machines that were part of my 'era', basically from the 70's and 80's, up until the introduction of the IBM XT and AT. (After that PC's became tools, not much more.) The idea was to have 2 of each, one to play with and one in storage.

So, I've been collecting for quite a while now but only recently started repairing and restoring. The beauty is now I get to play with all the machines I never actually owned and worked with. Quite a learning curve with every system but in the modern internet age, it's super easy to find the real dedicated communities (like this one!) and learn from them. :D

Decided to do them a "family" at a time. Just finished the Commodore family (must still do the PET) and now on the Acorns.

Still needs quite a few machines (would kill for a DAI! :D ) and also need to start moving some of the extra systems to new homes. The idea was to have two of each, not 9! :D

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Re: Floppy switch configs

Post by JannievanZyl » Fri Jan 05, 2018 5:17 pm

jgharston wrote:
JannievanZyl wrote:Right now I'm still trying to find the DFS format commands, etc. I've got DFS 1.2 on one machine and 0.9 on another.
The DFS format commands are *FORM40 and *FORM80 and they are on the DFS utilities disk, or you can type in a short BASIC program:

Code: Select all

REM > FormDFS
REM Quick Formatter
DIM X% 31,data% 511:Y%=X%DIV256:*DISK
ON ERROR REPORT:PRINT " at line ";ERL:OSCLI"FX180,"+STR$(PAGE/256):END
*FX180,64
INPUT"Drive:  "drive%
INPUT"Tracks: "num%
FOR track%=0 TO num%-1
  PRINT CHR$13;"Track ";track%;
  FOR sector%=0 TO 9
    data%!(sector%*4)=track%
    data%?(sector%*4+2)=(sector%+track%*7)MOD10
    data%?(sector%*4+3)=1
  NEXT sector%
  X%?0=drive%
  X%!1=data%
  X%!5=&6305
  X%?7=track%
  X%!8=&10002A10
  A%=127:REPEAT:CALL&FFF1:UNTIL X%?12<>&10
  IF X%?12:PRINT" error &";~X%?12
NEXT track%:PRINT
FOR A%=0 TO 511 STEP 4:data%!A%=0:NEXT A%
data%?&107=num%*10
data%?&106=num%/25.6
X%?0=drive%
X%!1=data%
X%!5=&4B03
X%!9=&22
A%=127:REPEAT:CALL&FFF1:UNTIL X%?10<>&10
IF X%?10:PRINT"write error &";~X%?10
OSCLI"FX180,"+STR$(PAGE/256):END
When I run this, I get two errors:

- Error 14 at Track 0
It'll then continue stepping through the tracks, up to 79 (it's a 80-track drive) and then;

- MISTAKE AT LINE 40 which is the 4th line from the top.

Any ideas?

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Re: Floppy switch configs

Post by JannievanZyl » Fri Jan 05, 2018 6:28 pm

Quick update;

Resolved the Error 14 on Track 0. I had two drives connected, ID 0 and ID 1 but only the first drive had power. When I disconnect the non-powered drive, I could format the disk. But only as a 40 track. Assume the media is the problem.

So now I can format either side with this program.

However, I still get the "Mistake at line 40" error after the format complete and it just loops until I Break out. Escape won't work.

"Mistake" implies a syntax error, right? But I can't see it in this line:

ON ERROR REPORT:PRINT " at line ";ERL:OSCLI"FX180,"+STR$(PAGE/256):END

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danielj
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Re: Floppy switch configs

Post by danielj » Fri Jan 05, 2018 11:30 pm

I wonder if you have basic 1 -it doesn't have the OSCLI command. What does it say if you type REPORT?

If it will only format 40 tracks, then it's a 40 track drive. It won't be the media.

d.

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Re: Floppy switch configs

Post by JannievanZyl » Sat Jan 06, 2018 2:34 pm

danielj wrote:I wonder if you have basic 1 -it doesn't have the OSCLI command. What does it say if you type REPORT?

If it will only format 40 tracks, then it's a 40 track drive. It won't be the media.

d.
Think you might be onto something;

- >REPORT? give "Syntax Error"

When I remove line 40 it then gives a "Mistake at Line 320" which also contains the OSCLI command.

Any way to check the BASIC version and - more importantly - how do I upgrade it? :)

Tx!!

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1024MAK
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Re: Floppy switch configs

Post by 1024MAK » Sat Jan 06, 2018 2:47 pm

You may also need to install a later OS chip.

If you are not able to program an EPROM or EEPROM chip, buy a ROM chip from Mark of RetroClinic. Contact him via PM (if PM's have been enabled on your account) or via his web site.

If you can program chips, you need a 27128, 27C128, 27256 or 27C256 EPROM (or suitable EEPROM chip with some wiring alterations). If going down this route, let us know.

Can you post a photo of the ROM/EPROM chips in your machine please?

Mark
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Re: Floppy switch configs

Post by johnkenyon » Sat Jan 06, 2018 3:08 pm

JannievanZyl wrote:
danielj wrote:I wonder if you have basic 1 -it doesn't have the OSCLI command. What does it say if you type REPORT?

If it will only format 40 tracks, then it's a 40 track drive. It won't be the media.

d.
Think you might be onto something;

- >REPORT? give "Syntax Error"

When I remove line 40 it then gives a "Mistake at Line 320" which also contains the OSCLI command.

Any way to check the BASIC version and - more importantly - how do I upgrade it? :)

Tx!!
To check the version of Basic, hit break and type the command 'REPORT' with no quotes or other punctuation. IIRC if it comes back with a string containing 1981 you have BASIC 1. If it comes back with 1982 you have BASIC 2.

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Re: Floppy switch configs

Post by JannievanZyl » Sat Jan 06, 2018 5:44 pm

johnkenyon wrote: To check the version of Basic, hit break and type the command 'REPORT' with no quotes or other punctuation. IIRC if it comes back with a string containing 1981 you have BASIC 1. If it comes back with 1982 you have BASIC 2.
Comes back with "(c) Acorn 1982".

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danielj
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Re: Floppy switch configs

Post by danielj » Sat Jan 06, 2018 5:47 pm

That's fundamentally odd then :?

Type

Code: Select all

OSCLI"HELP"
on a line on its own and see what it says?

d.

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Re: Floppy switch configs

Post by JannievanZyl » Sat Jan 06, 2018 5:51 pm

1024MAK wrote:You may also need to install a later OS chip.

If you are not able to program an EPROM or EEPROM chip, buy a ROM chip from Mark of RetroClinic. Contact him via PM (if PM's have been enabled on your account) or via his web site.

If you can program chips, you need a 27128, 27C128, 27256 or 27C256 EPROM (or suitable EEPROM chip with some wiring alterations). If going down this route, let us know.

Can you post a photo of the ROM/EPROM chips in your machine please?

Mark
I just ordered some ROMs from Mark, as it happens. :) But not a BASIC.

I can program a new BASIC ROM, no problem. Just need the correct bin file.

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1024MAK
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Re: Floppy switch configs

Post by 1024MAK » Sat Jan 06, 2018 6:13 pm

BBC BASIC, link to JGH's site

Acorn MOS versions are here ;-)

Mark
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Re: Floppy switch configs

Post by JannievanZyl » Sat Jan 06, 2018 6:14 pm

danielj wrote:That's fundamentally odd then :?

Type

Code: Select all

OSCLI"HELP"
on a line on its own and see what it says?

d.
I get the same output as *HELP......

DFS 1.20
DFS
UTILS

OS 1.20

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1024MAK
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Re: Floppy switch configs

Post by 1024MAK » Sat Jan 06, 2018 6:18 pm

Post above edited.
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danielj
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Re: Floppy switch configs

Post by danielj » Sat Jan 06, 2018 6:19 pm

So you definitely have BASIC 2. And OS 1.2.

I've just typed that line into beebem and it's fine. Not sure what's going on there... You must have transcribed it incorrectly.

Can you screenshot the first bit of the listing?

d.

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Re: Floppy switch configs

Post by 1024MAK » Sat Jan 06, 2018 6:24 pm

Don't enter extra spaces... and check any separators are correct.

Mark
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