A5000 hard drive and mouse not working :/

Arc/RPCs, peripherals, RISCOS operating system & ARM kit eg GP2x, BeagleBoard
Post Reply
SirCeej
Posts: 7
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2018 2:56 pm
Location: North East Wales
Contact:

A5000 hard drive and mouse not working :/

Post by SirCeej » Sun Aug 12, 2018 8:06 pm

Hi

Before I start writing about the faults, I'd just like to warn that I am new to repairing Acorn computers. And my knowledge of using them other than to play games is very limited. I was born the year the A5000 was launched.

I came across my Dad's old A5000 last week in our attic. It had the usual battery leak issue, which I have now cleaned and replaced with a CMOS Podule I ordered from CJE Micros. Computer is now actually booting up and getting to the desktop rather than the Supervisor mode. So great progress :D. Now I have other problems, one of them being that there's no Hard Drive icon on the bottom left of the screen. And the second one being, I can't move the mouse cursor. It seems to wobble at the centre of the screen when I try and move it, although I can just about move it up and down. But moving it sideways is definitely a no-no.

I am worried potentially about the Motherboard, I was told by a CJE Micros employee when I was ordering the podule, that the Hard drive components are very close to the CMOS area on the board. The hard drive was working fine before being stored away which was around 18 years ago.

Please see photos of the board attached. I do have a multimeter if I need to measure anything, I would be very thankful if somebody could tell me tell me how if that is the case. My knowledge in electronics is very limited.

Thank you :)
Attachments
Lluniau-3.jpg
Lluniau-2.jpg
Lluniau.jpg

steve3000
Posts: 1881
Joined: Sun Nov 25, 2012 12:43 am
Contact:

Re: A5000 hard drive and mouse not working :/

Post by steve3000 » Sun Aug 12, 2018 8:41 pm

Hello (and welcome to the forum! - you might want to say hello in the introductions thread).

Great to hear you've rescued an A5000, hopefully things aren't as bad as you think for the hard disc. First thing to remember with these old computers is that if you fit a new CMOS RAM chip, all settings will have been reset. So you need to tell the computer that it has a hard disc fitted :)

From the desktop, press f12, type *configure IDEDiscs 1

Then press return twice, shutdown (ctrl+shift+f12) and reset (ctrl+break) or switch off then on again.

Hopefully that'll restore your hard disc. If not, then it needs more investigation.

The mouse pointer wobbling in the middle of the screen suggests the IR LEDs have begun to fail inside the mouse itself. Easiest fix is to get a replacement mouse (I'd recommend using one of the hardware solutions to enable use of modern USB mice), the more tricky option fix is to take apart your mouse and move the LED and receiver very slightly closer together for each axis.

User avatar
jgharston
Posts: 3184
Joined: Thu Sep 24, 2009 11:22 am
Location: Whitby/Sheffield
Contact:

Re: A5000 hard drive and mouse not working :/

Post by jgharston » Sun Aug 12, 2018 8:46 pm

steve3000 wrote:
Sun Aug 12, 2018 8:41 pm
The mouse pointer wobbling in the middle of the screen suggests the IR LEDs have begun to fail inside the mouse itself.
Or that it's full of crud. Take the lid off and check the rollers are clean. I find the easiest way to do so it to use a finger nail to gently rub/scrape the crud off.

Code: Select all

$ bbcbasic
PDP11 BBC BASIC IV Version 0.25
(C) Copyright J.G.Harston 1989,2005-2015
>_

SirCeej
Posts: 7
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2018 2:56 pm
Location: North East Wales
Contact:

Re: A5000 hard drive and mouse not working :/

Post by SirCeej » Mon Aug 13, 2018 7:05 am

Brilliant, that doesn't sound a to bad. I will try a of this tonight when I've come home from work. Thank you :)

User avatar
daveejhitchins
Posts: 4349
Joined: Wed Jun 13, 2012 5:23 pm
Location: Newton Aycliffe, County Durham
Contact:

Re: A5000 hard drive and mouse not working :/

Post by daveejhitchins » Mon Aug 13, 2018 7:28 am

You've a problem with IC58 (leg missing or not soldered) and IC55 that still has blue corrosion on the socket pins. You need to treat the whole area with white vinegar, using a small brush (an old toothbrush works well!). Remove any socketed components first . . . Leave the vinegar on for about 10min. then wash off with 'soft' water (I use boiling water). Then you'll need to examine and measure for corrosion damage using a magnifying glass and your multimeter. If you can read a schematic (?) it will help you find your way around.

Dave H :D

Edit: After re-reading the first post.

You'll probably have lots of questions! Tackle one issue at a time - asking any questions here and acting on the guidance given. Your board doesn't look that bad, however, the corrosion tends to eat the small tracks of these boards - so patience is required. If you get chance to visit one of our get-togethers (next one in Cambridge) you'll get lots of hands-on help.
Last edited by daveejhitchins on Mon Aug 13, 2018 7:34 am, edited 1 time in total.
Parts: UM6502CE, GAL22V10D, GAL16V8D, AS6C62256A, TC514400AZ, WD1772, R6522, TMS27C512, AT28C256
Products: ARA II, ABR, ATI, AP6, MGC, AP5 . . .
For a price list, contact me at: Retro Hardware AT dave ej hitchins DOT plus DOT com

SirCeej
Posts: 7
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2018 2:56 pm
Location: North East Wales
Contact:

Re: A5000 hard drive and mouse not working :/

Post by SirCeej » Mon Aug 13, 2018 10:55 am

I have done some cleaning with White Vinegar/half water already, but not with the toothbrush. I didn't think that sorting the IC58 area would be necessary now that I have a podule with the CMOS chip. Saying that, could I completely remove the old CMOS chip now that it's out of action? Since the upper 2 pins on the right hand side have now completely detached from the board. The bottom 2 I cut to disable the data lines. Removing it completely would make it a lot easier to clean.

And with the IC55, I'm not too sure which area you mean? Is it these?
Attachments
Lluniau-2.jpg

User avatar
danielj
Posts: 6486
Joined: Thu Oct 02, 2008 4:51 pm
Location: Manchester
Contact:

Re: A5000 hard drive and mouse not working :/

Post by danielj » Mon Aug 13, 2018 12:12 pm

Hello! Welcome to the forum! You still need to kill off any hydroxide left there or it'll continue eating away at stuff. Just use the vinegar neat :) - no need to dilute. If you're not in a soft water area, do use deionised or distilled water to rinse the board off after the vinegar.

Once you've got all that cleaned up the next step is to start checking continuity of the different traces to the IDE port. You'll need a copy of the schematic: http://chrisacorns.computinghistory.org ... awings.zip

A multimeter which has a continuity test, or else just set one to the lowest resistance range and use that (a reading of near 0 will mean that you've got a good connection between points).
Last edited by danielj on Mon Aug 13, 2018 12:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
DutchAcorn
Posts: 1862
Joined: Fri Mar 21, 2014 9:56 am
Location: Maarn, Netherlands
Contact:

Re: A5000 hard drive and mouse not working :/

Post by DutchAcorn » Mon Aug 13, 2018 2:31 pm

Regrettably the battery alkali often damage more than than the CMOS circuit.

Have you checked if the floppy drive still works?

For repairing the IDE hard disc interface you may find it helpful to use my photo of the main board with references where to check for continuity: viewtopic.php?f=16&t=11059&p=206614#p137579

Removing the cmos chip won’t hurt. Best to try to cut the legs so that the PCB is less likely to incur more damage.
Paul

SirCeej
Posts: 7
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2018 2:56 pm
Location: North East Wales
Contact:

Re: A5000 hard drive and mouse not working :/

Post by SirCeej » Mon Aug 13, 2018 3:34 pm

Thanks DutchAcorn. That will help me alot! I haven't been able to try the floppy drive yet due to the mouse not working. But been told that the command *filer_opendir adfs::0.$ should launch it. So I'll give that a go tonight as well.

steve3000
Posts: 1881
Joined: Sun Nov 25, 2012 12:43 am
Contact:

Re: A5000 hard drive and mouse not working :/

Post by steve3000 » Mon Aug 13, 2018 6:27 pm

SirCeej wrote:
Mon Aug 13, 2018 10:55 am
I have done some cleaning with White Vinegar/half water already, but not with the toothbrush. I didn't think that sorting the IC58 area would be necessary now that I have a podule with the CMOS chip. Saying that, could I completely remove the old CMOS chip now that it's out of action? Since the upper 2 pins on the right hand side have now completely detached from the board. The bottom 2 I cut to disable the data lines. Removing it completely would make it a lot easier to clean.

And with the IC55, I'm not too sure which area you mean? Is it these?
No need to remove IC58 if the podule CMOS replacement works :) you could remove it, if you really want, but be careful not to damage surrounding tracking and components.

As for IC55, you could clean further with vinegar and a brush, followed by distilled water then IPA, but unless you have a FPA10 upgrade the socket will never be used.

SirCeej
Posts: 7
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2018 2:56 pm
Location: North East Wales
Contact:

Re: A5000 hard drive and mouse not working :/

Post by SirCeej » Mon Aug 13, 2018 7:15 pm

Good news, the command you advised to get the HD back worked, I can now see the Apps on the bottom left like I could 18 years ago :). I have also finished cleaning the motherboard and it looks a lot better now. The only things I need to fix now is the mouse. I have already opened it up, and I'd say it's quite clean inside, no dirt. I think I will order a new mouse tomorrow, most likely one with the serial connection to be on the safe side.

steve3000
Posts: 1881
Joined: Sun Nov 25, 2012 12:43 am
Contact:

Re: A5000 hard drive and mouse not working :/

Post by steve3000 » Mon Aug 13, 2018 10:53 pm

SirCeej wrote:
Mon Aug 13, 2018 7:15 pm
Good news, the command you advised to get the HD back worked, I can now see the Apps on the bottom left like I could 18 years ago :). I have also finished cleaning the motherboard and it looks a lot better now. The only things I need to fix now is the mouse. I have already opened it up, and I'd say it's quite clean inside, no dirt. I think I will order a new mouse tomorrow, most likely one with the serial connection to be on the safe side.
'Apps' on the left of the icon bar is the built-in ROM based software, the hard disc appears as the first icon just to the left of the floppy disc... Hopefully that is there :)

As for a mouse, options like the USB and PS/2 to Acorn adaptors are widely available - I've used both types at various times and found them to work perfectly (both using a nice modern optical mouse).

SirCeej
Posts: 7
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2018 2:56 pm
Location: North East Wales
Contact:

Re: A5000 hard drive and mouse not working :/

Post by SirCeej » Tue Aug 14, 2018 12:10 pm

Yes, both icons are there. Couldn't quite remember which was which. As with the mouse, I'll give CJE Micros a call to see what they have, as they have been very good so far! I will update as soon as it arrives. Hopefully then, it will require no more work on the motherboard.
Last edited by SirCeej on Tue Aug 14, 2018 1:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.

SirCeej
Posts: 7
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2018 2:56 pm
Location: North East Wales
Contact:

Re: A5000 hard drive and mouse not working :/

Post by SirCeej » Sat Aug 25, 2018 12:41 pm

Good news, the old a5000 seems to be fully working now. I am now using an USB mouse through an adapter to control the machine.

I have a network card plugged in to a podule now. I've tried following network setup instructions from this pagehttp://www.riscos.org/networking/riscos.html.

But when I click on !Boot, nothing happens excpt a 'AppServer' icon appearing bottom right. Any suggestions?

Post Reply