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New A3020 owner!

Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 7:51 am
by mattdy4
Morning all. Brought a non-working A3020 as a donor machine which I got yesterday only to find out after clearing the CMOS it works almost perfectly so far (apart from a dodgy "1" key) and is physically intact floppy button and all despite Hermes having got hold of it. It's great as I've been after one for a long, long time and got it for an absolute steal. It's a fairly yellowed AGB22 which has 2MB RAM oddly enough but as per spec, no HD.

The battery is still intact and doesn't appear to be leaking from the RAM slot opening but the first thing I'm going to do it snip that out and replace with a wired AA holder and give the whole thing a real good clean over the weekend. The machine looks like it was in use with a local authority (Somerset) until 1999 when it was last PAT tested and you can really tell from all the bits and dust inside! The keys are pretty yellowed too.

Once I'm done with that I want to upgrade it from stock so I'm looking for a bit of advice;

1) Hard disk. I don't have any 2.5" drives sitting around and wouldn't trust them if I did. Rather than take the gamble on a compatible IDE>CF would a 512MB DOM (Disk on Module) be the best way to go? I see they're around 8 quid on eBay and apparently they're more IDE compatible

2) Memory. Confused to why it has 2MB instead of 1MB. Once I open it up fully at the weekend I'll check the motherboard rev to see if it matches etc. The 4 ZIP slots aren't populated with anything other than dust so not sure how otherwise. Can I put in standard 28-pin ZIP chips to upgrade from 2MB>4MB like these?

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/OKI-M514800- ... SwPc9W2EbB

3) Gotek. I have a spare Gotek here waiting to be flashed with FlashFloppy which was going to go in my A3010 but as I have a few problems with that machine so I'm planning to use it here now. I've got one in my Amiga's so I'll spare everyone that part but are there any 3D mounts (stl files) so I can replace the internal drive cleanly that include a printed floppy button?

TIA!

Re: New A3020 owner!

Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 8:09 am
by danielj
Hullo there!
mattdy4 wrote: Once I'm done with that I want to upgrade it from stock so I'm looking for a bit of advice;

1) Hard disk. I don't have any 2.5" drives sitting around and wouldn't trust them if I did. Rather than take the gamble on a compatible IDE>CF would a 512MB DOM (Disk on Module) be the best way to go? I see they're around 8 quid on eBay and apparently they're more IDE compatible
Your mileage may vary - suck it and see is the only real way :( people have spent quite a bit of money trying to find ones that work -> However, if you're gotekking the thing, you can just load the wizzo IDEFS drivers from the "floppy" and use a cheap SD-IDE converter. That also has the added bonus of giving you four partitions!
2) Memory. Confused to why it has 2MB instead of 1MB. Once I open it up fully at the weekend I'll check the motherboard rev to see if it matches etc. The 4 ZIP slots aren't populated with anything other than dust so not sure how otherwise. Can I put in standard 28-pin ZIP chips to upgrade from 2MB>4MB like these?
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/OKI-M514800- ... SwPc9W2EbB
2mb is standard on the A3020. It's the A3010 that's only 1mb. Those are the right chips for the upgrade, it might well be possible to get them cheaper elsewhere though! (e.g. if you're prepared to wait: https://uk.utsource.net/sch/M514800-80Z )
3) Gotek. I have a spare Gotek here waiting to be flashed with FlashFloppy which was going to go in my A3010 but as I have a few problems with that machine so I'm planning to use it here now. I've got one in my Amiga's so I'll spare everyone that part but are there any 3D mounts (stl files) so I can replace the internal drive cleanly that include a printed floppy button?
TIA!
It'll work fine, AFAIK no one's done any 3D printed parts for putting one in an A30x0 yet though!

d.

Re: New A3020 owner!

Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 8:20 am
by flaxcottage
That sticking 1 key is relatively easy to fix if a little scary to do.

You will need to disassemble the keyboard and remove the fluff that will be affecting key presses. The connector pads on the plastic membrane for the 1 key may also need cleaning with IPA or a VERY soft pencil eraser. I managed to thoroughly clean an A5000 keyboard in just over 30 mins. It was my first time doing it and it worked perfectly when I'd finished. 8)

Re: New A3020 owner!

Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 8:26 am
by RobC
I successfully used a 2GB Apacer DOM with an A3020. (Only the first 512MB was usable under ADFS so I had to softload IDEFS to access the rest.)

Re: New A3020 owner!

Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 9:09 am
by steve3000
flaxcottage wrote:That sticking 1 key is relatively easy to fix if a little scary to do.
John's fix is the correct way... And it is most likely a small amount of contamination/dust between the membranes that is causing the dodgy key problem.

But if it's only one key affected, I've often found with these keyboards, that pressing the unresponsive key repeatedly over the course of a few days usage, can effectively resolve the problem. :)

Re: New A3020 owner!

Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 10:57 am
by mattdy4
mattdy4 wrote: Once I'm done with that I want to upgrade it from stock so I'm looking for a bit of advice;

1) Hard disk. I don't have any 2.5" drives sitting around and wouldn't trust them if I did. Rather than take the gamble on a compatible IDE>CF would a 512MB DOM (Disk on Module) be the best way to go? I see they're around 8 quid on eBay and apparently they're more IDE compatible

Your mileage may vary - suck it and see is the only real way :( people have spent quite a bit of money trying to find ones that work -> However, if you're gotekking the thing, you can just load the wizzo IDEFS drivers from the "floppy" and use a cheap SD-IDE converter. That also has the added bonus of giving you four partitions!
I'll probably go down the DOM route first before splashing out on lots of SD/CF adapters! I had read about the Wizzo drivers and will look at them more now though, thanks
2) Memory. Confused to why it has 2MB instead of 1MB. Once I open it up fully at the weekend I'll check the motherboard rev to see if it matches etc. The 4 ZIP slots aren't populated with anything other than dust so not sure how otherwise. Can I put in standard 28-pin ZIP chips to upgrade from 2MB>4MB like these?
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/OKI-M514800- ... SwPc9W2EbB

2mb is standard on the A3020. It's the A3010 that's only 1mb. Those are the right chips for the upgrade, it might well be possible to get them cheaper elsewhere though! (e.g. if you're prepared to wait: https://uk.utsource.net/sch/M514800-80Z )
Ah it's because I took the info from Chris's page and fell into the same trap that others have - typo it's 1MB floppy not 1MB RAM which makes more sense

Do you need 4 of those ZIP chips (4x512k) or does one work and give 4MB? :?

Re: New A3020 owner!

Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 11:00 am
by mattdy4
flaxcottage wrote:That sticking 1 key is relatively easy to fix if a little scary to do.

You will need to disassemble the keyboard and remove the fluff that will be affecting key presses. The connector pads on the plastic membrane for the 1 key may also need cleaning with IPA or a VERY soft pencil eraser. I managed to thoroughly clean an A5000 keyboard in just over 30 mins. It was my first time doing it and it worked perfectly when I'd finished. 8)
Used the same method to clean my 3010 k/b. It's so dusty I suspect it's the issue rather than a faulty membrane.

God I hate all those little clips...

Re: New A3020 owner!

Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 11:05 am
by matt_nottm
If you are looking to go the DOM route, then this thread may be helpful?
http://www.stardot.org.uk/forums/viewto ... 30#p172728

This will format you a native Risc OS 3.1 accessible drive. You need other software, as others have described earlier, for more partitions:
IMG_2810.JPG

Re: New A3020 owner!

Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 11:15 am
by mattdy4
RobC wrote:I successfully used a 2GB Apacer DOM with an A3020. (Only the first 512MB was usable under ADFS so I had to softload IDEFS to access the rest.)
Ordered a 512mb Apacer DOM from Germany for 8EUR all in. Might take a while to get here but I'll play Gotek in the meantime :D

Re: New A3020 owner!

Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 11:58 am
by danielj
mattdy4 wrote: Do you need 4 of those ZIP chips (4x512k) or does one work and give 4MB? :?
Yup, you need four.

d.

Re: New A3020 owner!

Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 12:41 pm
by trixster
I think the DOM route is the way forward too.

You can get an A3020 to work with a cheap IDE-SD adapter but in my experience the adapter has to be one of the rare two chip versions, not the one chip. Some IDE-CF adapters do work but not all CF cards work, so you can spend a lot of time trying different varieties until you get a working pair!

Re: New A3020 owner!

Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 2:30 pm
by mattdy4
danielj wrote: 2mb is standard on the A3020. It's the A3010 that's only 1mb. Those are the right chips for the upgrade, it might well be possible to get them cheaper elsewhere though! (e.g. if you're prepared to wait: https://uk.utsource.net/sch/M514800-80Z )
Found a UK-based supplier for these OKI chips;

https://godiac.co.uk/products/m514800-8 ... 2572050502

Brought 4

Re: New A3020 owner!

Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 2:38 pm
by danielj
Good work - that's a darn sight cheaper than £12/pop! :D

d.

Re: New A3020 owner!

Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 3:39 pm
by sbadger
Daniel's right about the cf/sd to IDE being uncertain, but I can confirm this one works in my 3020

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ... 0942895708

if you decide to give it a go.

Re: New A3020 owner!

Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 5:35 pm
by danielj
sbadger wrote:Daniel's right about the cf/sd to IDE being uncertain, but I can confirm this one works in my 3020

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ... 0942895708

if you decide to give it a go.
It depends on the card - the adapter is just a straight through thing. Basically means you have a card that speaks the right version of IDE in your adaptor.

d.

Re: New A3020 owner!

Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 9:16 pm
by lcww1
I’ve had consistently reliable results on RO 3.11 on A3020, A3010, A4000, and A5000 with genuine SanDisk 512Mb CF cards - there are some guides on the web explaining how to identify genuine SanDisk cards from fakes, and it may be that the prevalence of fakery at the time that 512Mb CF cards were produced was relatively low - anyhow, I’ve had good results with these from this source -

https://m.ebay.co.uk/itm/512MB-SANDISK- ... SwUeFZ1nBs

I’ve no connection with this seller other than having purchased a (RO friendly) CF card or two

Re: New A3020 owner!

Posted: Sat Apr 07, 2018 10:41 am
by mattdy4
Got the memory this morning, less than 24 hours for delivery.

I'd be impressed but I can't get it working :(

Installed in all 4 slots and changed the two jumpers to recognise the additional memory (http://www.simtec.co.uk/products/AU4M30 ... nstall.pdf) but I get POST errors and then a whole load of errors roll on-screen. I've checked the serial number against the list of machines that don't like the memory upgrading and it's not one of them.

Am I missing something obvious here or just incompatible memory?

Re: New A3020 owner!

Posted: Sat Apr 07, 2018 10:49 am
by danielj
Hold delete on boot?

Re: New A3020 owner!

Posted: Sat Apr 07, 2018 11:09 am
by mattdy4
danielj wrote:Hold delete on boot?
Tried that, that's how I got the errors to display.
The RAM doesn't show which is pin 1. Could I have it inserted the wrong way? OKI print on chip is facing left

Re: New A3020 owner!

Posted: Sat Apr 07, 2018 11:19 am
by mattdy4
mattdy4 wrote:
danielj wrote:Hold delete on boot?
Tried that, that's how I got the errors to display.
The RAM doesn't show which is pin 1. Could I have it inserted the wrong way? OKI print on chip is facing left
Yup it was wrong way round - OKI print faces right towards IDE connector. The lower dot closest to the pins was the clue! :D

Shows 4096k on boot now and in GUI

Re: New A3020 owner!

Posted: Sat Apr 07, 2018 11:27 am
by daveejhitchins
mattdy4 wrote:Yup it was wrong way round - OKI print faces right towards IDE connector. The lower dot closest to the pins was the clue! :D
Wow . . . Who's a luck boy then? I'd nip-out and buy some Lottery Tickets :lol:

Dave H :D