BeebSCSI mini

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flynnjs
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BeebSCSI mini

Postby flynnjs » Fri Jun 09, 2017 8:02 am

I'm pleased to announce that I've made up a few BeebSCSI minis and made them available on my webshop.
Many thanks to Simon for his design and efforts (see: http://www.domesday86.com/?page_id=400)

My version is a direct copy other than using SMD termination resistors and shrinking the PCB so
that it fits under a model B, like the Lx9CoPro does.

Available to buy here:
http://www.xeropage.co.uk/shop/index.ph ... er=product

Pictured below: early version of BeebSCSImini next to Lx9CoPro (not included!)
IMG_0872.jpg

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Elminster
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Re: BeebSCSI mini

Postby Elminster » Fri Jun 09, 2017 8:37 am

Great. I will add item to the hardware list.

Also realised now I had assumed that BeebSCSI always fitted to master internal 1 mhz port, clearly that is not the case and they should be 2 seperate items.

Is hte link in the more info section on your website meant to be a hotlink. It is a bit cold at the moment.

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paulv
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Re: BeebSCSI mini

Postby paulv » Sun Jun 11, 2017 9:50 pm

Sold out already! Are you planning on doing another run?

Paul

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1024MAK
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Re: BeebSCSI mini

Postby 1024MAK » Mon Jun 12, 2017 12:05 am

paulv wrote:Sold out already! Are you planning on doing another run?

Paul

Yes, I missed the boat as well... :(

Mark
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flynnjs
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Re: BeebSCSI mini

Postby flynnjs » Mon Jun 12, 2017 12:07 am

Yes, I'll be doing some more but I need to get another batch of PCBs in first.

KenLowe
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Re: BeebSCSI mini

Postby KenLowe » Sat Jun 24, 2017 9:43 pm

Duh. Missed the boat here as well. Can you please let me know when you get these back in stock. I'm very keen to get one! BTW, what's the red and black wires for? Is this external power, or perhaps disk activity LED?

Edit: Ah. I see it needs an external 5v. Can this be plugged into the 6 pin connector on the BBC PSU?

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simoni
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Re: BeebSCSI mini

Postby simoni » Sun Jun 25, 2017 3:55 am

Ah. I see it needs an external 5v. Can this be plugged into the 6 pin connector on the BBC PSU?


Yes; you have 3 basic options to power it. External 5Vs from the Acorn PSU, external 5Vs from a wall-wart style regulated PSU or you can mount it internally and take the 5Vs from one of the power feeds to the motherboard (it uses less than 200mA). The 1MHz bus does not supply power (hence the need for the additional connector).

Full project documentation (manual, technical guide and hardware guide) is available from http://www.domesday86.com/. The source code is also available on GitHub (GPLv3 open-source).

There is also an on board status LED that shows the drive activity.

/Simon

KenLowe
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Re: BeebSCSI mini

Postby KenLowe » Sun Jun 25, 2017 8:22 am

simoni wrote:The 1MHz bus does not supply power (hence the need for the additional connector).

That's a bit annoying, given that there's plenty of 'spare' 0v pins on the connector. I guess BITD they might have been concerned about powering up large pieces of external 1MHz kit from the internal BBC PSU.

I thought I might be able to get a suitable supply from the printer port, since my user port is in use for my MMFS card, but there's no 5v there either. I'm now considering taking it from the JP1 power jumper on the 'UnderBBC' Kjell level shifter that's connected to my BBC. Hopefully that feed will be able to power both the BeebSCSI mini board and the RPi0 / PiTubeDirect.

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grobda
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Re: BeebSCSI mini

Postby grobda » Sat Jul 01, 2017 5:04 pm

interested if another batch is made, any idea if you could boot a Master 512 OS from one?

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simoni
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Re: BeebSCSI mini

Postby simoni » Sat Jul 01, 2017 5:12 pm

any idea if you could boot a Master 512 OS from one?


BeebSCSI emulates the original Acorn SCSI system... anything the original could do, it can also do (there should be no incompatibilities since it uses the original, unpatched, Acorn ADFS).

My Master 512 has one in and boots both DOS and GEM without issues; the only difference is how fast it boots :)

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flynnjs
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Re: BeebSCSI mini

Postby flynnjs » Mon Jul 03, 2017 7:04 pm

I shall do another batch but I need to gauge interest, so I'll run a list here for a week or so.

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simoni
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Re: BeebSCSI mini

Postby simoni » Mon Jul 03, 2017 9:03 pm

I shall do another batch but I need to gauge interest, so I'll run a list here for a week or so.


I've posted a note about this over on the facebook group - too directing any interest here.

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RobGT
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Re: BeebSCSI mini

Postby RobGT » Tue Jul 04, 2017 6:17 am

Hi Flynnjs,

You can count me in for one BeebSCSI mini card.
Thanks for your initiative.

Regards,
RobGT

dwarfmage
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Re: BeebSCSI mini

Postby dwarfmage » Tue Jul 04, 2017 6:21 am

I'd be interested in one if you do another batch

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simoni
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Re: BeebSCSI mini

Postby simoni » Tue Jul 04, 2017 9:00 am

So there is no confusion over BeebSCSI and what it is for; I've added a new 'overview' section to the project site that provides the highlights including what's great about BeebSCSI compared to other BBC Model B and Master storage solutions (although "Open-source, fastest and 64 Gbytes of storage" sums it up :) )

http://www.domesday86.com/?page_id=689

markrwj
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Re: BeebSCSI mini

Postby markrwj » Tue Jul 04, 2017 1:14 pm

I would also be interested in one. Thx

PhilYoung
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Re: BeebSCSI mini

Postby PhilYoung » Tue Jul 04, 2017 1:37 pm

Hi,

I'd also like to register an interest in one of these, please.

Cheers,

Phil Young

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DutchAcorn
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Re: BeebSCSI mini

Postby DutchAcorn » Tue Jul 04, 2017 3:49 pm

This is a great project and I would also like to have one but...

Since ADFS will take quite a bit of resources on a model B I take it that BeebSCSI is mostly targetted for the Master.

But it won't physically fit in the 1MHz port of the Master so it will either need an extention cable or an additional module to fit it internally?

Internal fitting would be much preferred but is the module to do that also available? Alternatively; do you have extension cables you could offer?

Thanks!
Paul

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simoni
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Re: BeebSCSI mini

Postby simoni » Tue Jul 04, 2017 9:09 pm

Since ADFS will take quite a bit of resources on a model B I take it that BeebSCSI is mostly targetted for the Master.


ADFS is ADFS... as with any hard drive solution for an 8-bit Acorn, it's required. On my beebs I have switchable DFS and ADFS (which I believe is quite common?). BeebSCSI isn't 'targeted' to either; as a SCSI emulation system it's only 'target' is ADFS.

The BeebSCSI mini board is optimised (in size) so you can fit it under a Beeb, the original board can be mounted inside a master, but in either case you will need to connect it to the external 1 MHz bus port, since that's what hard drives connect to when using ADFS. BeebSCSI can be connected to the Master's internal 1 MHz bus, but then it will only operate with VFS and acts like a VP415 laser disc player (and VFS is read only). All of these things are constraints of the machine rather than BeebSCSI (actually the VFS support is a bonus of BeebSCSI, since there are no other 'real' SCSI solutions, nothing else out there can work with VFS at all). It's theoretically possible to patch ADFS to target the Master's internal bus, but no one's done it yet.

I'll leave it up to Jason to state if he will make any extension cables; but you could always put a standard IDC header on the mini board (just like the original board design) and then just use a normal ribbon cable.

RobC
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Re: BeebSCSI mini

Postby RobC » Wed Jul 05, 2017 7:03 am

DutchAcorn wrote:Since ADFS will take quite a bit of resources on a model B I take it that BeebSCSI is mostly targetted for the Master.

I fitted one of these to my B+ (in a 32KB socket) and installed DFSE00 and ADFSE00:
https://datasheets.maximintegrated.com/en/ds/DS1230AB-DS1230Y.pdf

You could do the same in a model B with a bit of hacking. It's non-volatile and has unlimited write cycles so is ideal for holding the E00 images. They use sideways RAM to hold their workspace and keep PAGE at &E00.

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daveejhitchins
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Re: BeebSCSI mini

Postby daveejhitchins » Wed Jul 05, 2017 8:05 am

Please reserve two four for me . . .

Thanks - Dave H :D

Edit: Increased number now I know they work on the Electron :D
Last edited by daveejhitchins on Thu Jul 20, 2017 9:31 am, edited 1 time in total.
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For a price list, contact me at: Retro Hardware AT dave ej hitchins DOT plus DOT com

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flynnjs
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Re: BeebSCSI mini

Postby flynnjs » Thu Jul 06, 2017 6:35 am

RobC wrote:
DutchAcorn wrote:Since ADFS will take quite a bit of resources on a model B I take it that BeebSCSI is mostly targetted for the Master.

I fitted one of these to my B+ (in a 32KB socket) and installed DFSE00 and ADFSE00:
https://datasheets.maximintegrated.com/en/ds/DS1230AB-DS1230Y.pdf

You could do the same in a model B with a bit of hacking. It's non-volatile and has unlimited write cycles so is ideal for holding the E00 images. They use sideways RAM to hold their workspace and keep PAGE at &E00.


I have done the same, although it's worth noting the ADFSe00 does not work with
all software. Therefore a toggle switch on the top address pin to allow the other
16k to be paged in with normal ADFS can be useful.

I won't be making up IDC cables as they're not difficult to DIY.

As Simon points out, he has a solution to mount internally on the Master. I'm
unlikely to make any of these available myself.

I must say that seeing an ADFS directory listing appear on the screen via BeebSCSI
so quickly is impressive and even faster when using a CoPro at 64MHz.
DOS on the 286 CoPro also works really nicely.

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danielj
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Re: BeebSCSI mini

Postby danielj » Thu Jul 06, 2017 6:36 am

Jason, I'm interested but will probably have to wait until next month :? Its birthday fest at the moment...!

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paulv
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Re: BeebSCSI mini

Postby paulv » Thu Jul 06, 2017 6:50 am

As I said previously, I missed the last batch so definitely interested in 2 boards :D

Paul

dangardner
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Re: BeebSCSI mini

Postby dangardner » Thu Jul 06, 2017 3:06 pm

Also interested in a board please.

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IanS
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Re: BeebSCSI mini

Postby IanS » Thu Jul 06, 2017 8:04 pm

Put me down for two, Thanks.

KenLowe
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Re: BeebSCSI mini

Postby KenLowe » Sat Jul 08, 2017 8:26 pm

Also interested in buying one of these. Thanks.

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1024MAK
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Re: BeebSCSI mini

Postby 1024MAK » Sun Jul 09, 2017 9:53 am

Two boards for me please [-o<

Mark
For a "Complete BBC Games Archive" visit www.bbcmicro.co.uk NOW!
BeebWiki‬ - for answers to many questions...

mph1708
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Re: BeebSCSI mini

Postby mph1708 » Sat Jul 15, 2017 12:09 pm

I would be interested in one of these boards. Regards

iainjh
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Re: BeebSCSI mini

Postby iainjh » Sat Jul 15, 2017 12:20 pm

I'd like 1 x board please!

cheers :)


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