LCD TVs and monitors for use with BBCs

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iainjh
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Re: LCD TVs and monitors for use with BBCs

Postby iainjh » Mon Jul 16, 2012 10:04 pm

retroclinic mark - or anyone else - did you get the V4 board and have a chance to compare its output etc? esp re the white specks.

cheers :)

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retroclinic
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Re: LCD TVs and monitors for use with BBCs

Postby retroclinic » Mon Jul 16, 2012 10:07 pm

I've got one, but not played with it yet.
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semtex
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Re: LCD TVs and monitors for use with BBCs

Postby semtex » Tue Jul 17, 2012 5:02 am

Hello Elminster

I just used trial and error to find the language when I got my GBS8200. Do the following...

Press MENU
Press DOWN or UP until the yellow marker is beside 4
Press MENU
Press DOWN or UP until the yellow marker is beside 1 (English)
Press MENU

That's it.

Regards

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Elminster
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Re: LCD TVs and monitors for use with BBCs

Postby Elminster » Tue Jul 17, 2012 8:09 am

Thanks Semtex, I'll give it a go. Trial and error was next of my todo list.

Although ironically I did play with the controls on the LCD tv and now I have an excellent crisp picture from my rgb to scart socket. Perhaps I should have tried that before buying the gbs8200!

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1024MAK
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Re: LCD TVs and monitors for use with BBCs

Postby 1024MAK » Tue Jul 17, 2012 9:27 am

English (well, kinda) instructions here http://en.gonbes.com/serverdown.asp
Also PDF version here http://info-coach.fr/atari/hardware/vid ... verter.pdf
This page is about using with an Atari ST, but it does give useful information on using one of these converters http://info-coach.fr/atari/hardware/video.php#GBS

Mark
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Elminster
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Re: LCD TVs and monitors for use with BBCs

Postby Elminster » Tue Jul 17, 2012 11:54 pm

Well I have my menus in English now, but I didn't really expect it help much. I do now have a nicer picture, but no amount of pressing auto stops the picture being a bit jittery.

I have tried a different monitor cable and monitor but same effect.

So that just leaves me the rgb cable from the master, and the psu I am driving the gbs8200 with, which isn't quite right (1.5A @ 5v or 2A @ 7v, docs say it wants 2A at 5V. Although the board itself as 5V-12V printed on the PCB.

Looking at 1024Mak previous posts and the Atari link below I see that people have played with resistors on Sync to get a more stable picture.

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1024MAK
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Re: LCD TVs and monitors for use with BBCs

Postby 1024MAK » Wed Jul 18, 2012 1:34 am

Elminster wrote:Well I have my menus in English now, but I didn't really expect it help much. I do now have a nicer picture, but no amount of pressing auto stops the picture being a bit jittery.
<snip>
So that just leaves me the rgb cable from the master, and the psu I am driving the gbs8200 with, which isn't quite right (1.5A @ 5v or 2A @ 7v, docs say it wants 2A at 5V. Although the board itself as 5V-12V printed on the PCB.
Looking at 1024Mak previous posts and the Atari link below I see that people have played with resistors on Sync to get a more stable picture.
I recommend reading from here
The geometry settings do affect the stability of the picture - see here
Always press the auto button after changing the settings. Sometimes it works better if you power down / up then press the auto button. If you press the auto button for over 5 seconds when not in a menu, it resets the system.
I believe the input supply voltage is passed to a 3.3V voltage regulator (but I have not fully checked this out), so it may be possible to run it from a different PSU. However, too high a input voltage will cause the 3.3V voltage regulator to run hot. This would not be good.

Mark
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VincentVega
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Re: LCD TVs and monitors for use with BBCs

Postby VincentVega » Wed Jul 18, 2012 6:38 pm

Bit of a long shot, perhaps, but has anyone tried one of these to get their Beeb to play ball with an LCD TV:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Atari-ST-Exte ... 901wt_1236

If you can look beyond the Comic Sans text and the fact it's labelled as for an Atari ST, it does say it can convert CGA and EGA output to a suitable form. If you look on his web site (http://www.scandoubler.info) it does say that he can produce custom versions.

I have an Atari STE (as well as my Beeb) so I was considering buying one of these things, as the output I get from the STE on my Sony TV with the TV cable is atrocious, and the SCART lead I bought doesn't work. It would be nice if it did work with the Beeb as well; that GBS board doesn't fill me with a huge amount of confidence (seems a bit flaky).

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paulv
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Re: LCD TVs and monitors for use with BBCs

Postby paulv » Wed Jul 18, 2012 8:16 pm

That looks very much to me like someone has packaged up a GBS-8220 into a case with a cable pre-built for the Atari ST. I note on the website, it also shows Amiga screen shots.

I guess the "custom" versions would be cables suitable to your requirements for your particular computer...

Paul

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Re: LCD TVs and monitors for use with BBCs

Postby VincentVega » Thu Jul 19, 2012 5:57 pm

You're right, it is. I poked around a few Atari web sites and there was an image showing the same GBS board inside the box.

Cost of board = £20.00
Nice shiny box + cable = £64.00

Hmm. I think I'll just risk buying the board on its own.

iainjh
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Re: LCD TVs and monitors for use with BBCs

Postby iainjh » Thu Aug 09, 2012 1:29 pm

Hi

I've acquired an 8220 and am presently 'engineering' it to use in a master compact

Have some tests to do (olympics viewing allowing!) but a lashed up output looks ok at present.

Can anyone please advise what the input and output sockets are called on an 8220 so i can order the right plugs and wire it up properly?

Marked P11 and P4 respectively ( see link http://nfggames.com/forum2/index.php?topic=3508.0 for detail , P11 and P4 are the 8 pin connectors next to the D-sub's) I need to order the correct plugs and the female metal connectors therein

ta!

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Re: LCD TVs and monitors for use with BBCs

Postby iainjh » Thu Aug 09, 2012 7:38 pm


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sweh
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Re: LCD TVs and monitors for use with BBCs

Postby sweh » Sun Aug 12, 2012 1:05 am

iainjh wrote:did you get the V4 board and have a chance to compare its output etc? esp re the white specks.

Related question to this: how can I tell if someone is selling a v4 board and not an older one? I've spent ages trawling ebay (.com, since I'm in the US) and not been able to determine anything that lets me know!

Any advice on how I can make sure I'm getting the right board is appreciated!
Rgds
Stephen

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1024MAK
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Re: LCD TVs and monitors for use with BBCs

Postby 1024MAK » Sun Aug 12, 2012 11:36 am

Look at the picture on eBay that the seller has provided, and double check by then asking the seller... :D
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GBS-8200 V4 highlight.JPG
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1024MAK
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Re: LCD TVs and monitors for use with BBCs

Postby 1024MAK » Sun Aug 12, 2012 11:49 am

I notice that some sellers now have HD9800/GBS8200 V5.0 boards for sale (see here (UK) and here (USA)).
Anyone got a V5.0 yet? Does it work better?

Mark
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sweh
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Re: LCD TVs and monitors for use with BBCs

Postby sweh » Sun Aug 12, 2012 5:46 pm

1024MAK wrote:Look at the picture on eBay that the seller has provided, and double check by then asking the seller... :D

Are the pictures reliable though? If I see a v4 board then it's likely to be one, but a picture of a v3 board could just simply be an old picture that the vendor hasn't updated or stole from another place or...

That's the problem with China/HK based stuff; it changes so frequently that vendors may not update their descriptions even though they've got newer stock!
Rgds
Stephen

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danielj
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Re: LCD TVs and monitors for use with BBCs

Postby danielj » Sun Aug 12, 2012 8:19 pm

sweh wrote:That's the problem with China/HK based stuff; it changes so frequently that vendors may not update their descriptions even though they've got newer stock!


I just asked them all explicitly. There are enough selling that if one doesn't know or doesn't understand the question there's another that does... Took me about 3 attempts to get a definite "yes, it's a 4".

d.

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sweh
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Re: LCD TVs and monitors for use with BBCs

Postby sweh » Sun Aug 12, 2012 10:41 pm

danielj wrote:
sweh wrote:That's the problem with China/HK based stuff; it changes so frequently that vendors may not update their descriptions even though they've got newer stock!


I just asked them all explicitly. There are enough selling that if one doesn't know or doesn't understand the question there's another that does... Took me about 3 attempts to get a definite "yes, it's a 4".

d.

Of the 4 I asked the only one who even answered said "yes" but never sent it out (got my money back yesterday). I guess I'll just keep trying!
Rgds
Stephen

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Re: LCD TVs and monitors for use with BBCs

Postby semtex » Sun Aug 12, 2012 11:42 pm

Stephen
I got my v4 board from http://www.ebay.ca/itm/CGA-EGA-RGB-VGA- ... 46021ab5da. No problems whatsoever with the buyer. See my post earlier in this thread on the geometry settings I used and how I mounted it inside the case. Get a decent 2A power supply for it.

Regards

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sweh
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Re: LCD TVs and monitors for use with BBCs

Postby sweh » Mon Aug 13, 2012 2:31 am

semtex wrote:Stephen
I got my v4 board from http://www.ebay.ca/itm/CGA-EGA-RGB-VGA- ... 46021ab5da. No problems whatsoever with the buyer. See my post earlier in this thread on the geometry settings I used and how I mounted it inside the case. Get a decent 2A power supply for it.

Regards

Thanks. That's one of the odd ones I'd spotted before; the top picture is a v4 board but later pictures aren't. Ugh. With your recommendation, though, I'll give it a go :-)

Thanks!
Rgds
Stephen

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sweh
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Re: LCD TVs and monitors for use with BBCs

Postby sweh » Sat Aug 18, 2012 6:28 pm

sweh wrote:
semtex wrote:Stephen
I got my v4 board from http://www.ebay.ca/itm/CGA-EGA-RGB-VGA- ... 46021ab5da. No problems whatsoever with the buyer. See my post earlier in this thread on the geometry settings I used and how I mounted it inside the case. Get a decent 2A power supply for it.

Regards

Thanks. That's one of the odd ones I'd spotted before; the top picture is a v4 board but later pictures aren't. Ugh. With your recommendation, though, I'll give it a go :-)

Thanks!

Well, that vendor just said it was a series III board. *sigh* But this guy knew what he was talking about and sent me a v4 board. Now I just have to re-read this thread and work out how to hook it up :-)

Thanks!
Rgds
Stephen

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Re: LCD TVs and monitors for use with BBCs

Postby sweh » Sun Aug 19, 2012 12:30 am

sweh wrote:Now I just have to re-read this thread and work out how to hook it up :-)


With no resisters I hooked into P11 RGBS 8 pin connector. I did some adjusting and resizing, but...

In mode 7 I'm seeing slight ghosting. In mode 0 and 3 the character definition is lacking. This _could_ just be 'cos my monitor is 1280x1024 native and we're seeing the consequences of non-native input.

But despite that... this is the best picture I've ever had from my Beeb. It's much better than what I had BITD :-)
Rgds
Stephen

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Elminster
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Re: LCD TVs and monitors for use with BBCs

Postby Elminster » Sun Aug 19, 2012 9:08 am

Sounds similar to results I had above. Although fiddling with the LCD t/monitor I ended up with a perfect picture using SCART. So intend to come back to this project another day.

As an aside has anyone tried any of the HDMI upscalers, with either SCART or VGA input?

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Re: LCD TVs and monitors for use with BBCs

Postby sorvad » Sun Aug 19, 2012 11:32 am

I was having problems with a cheap Technika LCD, poor picture from SCART, poor from UHF (as expected), then for whatever reason (moment of madness or inspiration !) I plugged them both in at once (UHF and SCART) and lo and behold an amazing picture ! Rock steady, crystal clear picture even in 80 column modes. Might be worth trying for other people of they are having issues with RGB -> SCART. The TV was set to display the SCART image but without the UHF feed it was rubbish.

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paulv
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Re: LCD TVs and monitors for use with BBCs

Postby paulv » Sun Aug 19, 2012 12:31 pm

sorvad wrote:The TV was set to display the SCART image but without the UHF feed it was rubbish.


Grounding issue with your SCART cable?

Paul

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sorvad
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Re: LCD TVs and monitors for use with BBCs

Postby sorvad » Sun Aug 19, 2012 1:07 pm

Could be, that would make some sense, can't remember if it's one I made or one that I've picked up along the way with other kit. Either way works like it is so can't be bothered to investigate :)

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Re: LCD TVs and monitors for use with BBCs

Postby PitfallJones » Mon Aug 20, 2012 2:15 am

As an aside has anyone tried any of the HDMI upscalers, with either SCART or VGA input?


Yeah I've tried scart->HDMI (720p) and scart->component (576i) converter boxes.

I'm overseas so it's almost impossible get SCART TVs and 50% of the time normal TVs will not sync to 50Hz.

Saying that Samsung used to make the 730mw and 940mw monitors that were the only ones available with SCART built in and they would display 50hz SCART from the BBC ok - although the colour guns were a little off in the resultant picture sometimes.

The picture from scart->component is excellent if the TV can do 50hz because it just converts the BBC signal to 576i 4:3.
component.jpg
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The picture from scart->hdmi however is normally scaled to the widescreen and is much less probable to work at 50hz so the picture has noise or flickers on and off if it is visible at all - I've had varying success with Samsung, Panasonic and Sony TVs.

hdmi.jpg
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I've had no luck at all with a SCART to VGA cable with LCD tvs and computer monitors.

- PJ

scart_to_hdmi.jpg
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scart_to_yuv.jpg
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retroclinic
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Re: LCD TVs and monitors for use with BBCs

Postby retroclinic » Wed Aug 22, 2012 10:39 am

For those in the US, cheap working DVS204 here

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ... 0869375716

Pic is miles better on these than the Gonbes. I have the cables for the Beeb for them, if you get stuck making your own.

Mark.
Image

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danielj
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Re: LCD TVs and monitors for use with BBCs

Postby danielj » Wed Aug 22, 2012 1:15 pm

retroclinic wrote:For those in the US, cheap working DVS204 here

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ... 0869375716

Pic is miles better on these than the Gonbes. I have the cables for the Beeb for them, if you get stuck making your own.

Mark.


That was too cheap. Called in a favour. Mark, may well be in touch re. cables once it wends its way here. Wasn't there something about the PSU in them being a bit flakey too?

d.

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retroclinic
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Re: LCD TVs and monitors for use with BBCs

Postby retroclinic » Wed Aug 22, 2012 9:31 pm

danielj wrote:
retroclinic wrote:For those in the US, cheap working DVS204 here

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ... 0869375716

Pic is miles better on these than the Gonbes. I have the cables for the Beeb for them, if you get stuck making your own.

Mark.


That was too cheap. Called in a favour. Mark, may well be in touch re. cables once it wends its way here. Wasn't there something about the PSU in them being a bit flakey too?

d.


Yes a good price - I would have bought it myself, but I'm trying to have a clearout. The PSUs in all earlier Extron equipment is flakey (amounts to a good 25% of ALL our callouts at work). If all the lights flash, or it's dead, try replacing the startup cap, and all the output smoothing caps. If that doesn't fix it, then they're usually BER. I can get new ones from Extron for you, they're about £40.

Mark.
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