kryoflux for the BBC

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johnnysh
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kryoflux for the BBC

Postby johnnysh » Wed Jun 12, 2013 1:46 pm

Hello

I have just purchased a kryoflux PCB, though as all my archiving of floppys is BBC computer related I am starting to feel the kryoflux may have been a waste of money ?

Whilst playing around a little last night it would seem the kryoflux for the BBC is a one way archive system i.e. from the BBC floppy drive to the PC, as a stored image file. There seems no way to do anything with image file other than to view in a hex editor on the PC. I would like the ability to be able to archive BBC floppys from the floppy drive to the PC, and then recreate new floppys for use on the BBC computer from the PC image not an emulator on the PC.

At present it would seem this is not achievable ? and there does not seem any info as to how long it will be in years / months before one can do this. I'm not even sure if the images I am storing on my P.C. of my BBC protected floppy games / disks etc. are even good working images that have been made by kryoflux?

So I am a little disappointed in spending a £100 odd pound and then finding out I can only create images and not recreate floppys for my BBC of the archived images on the PC.

I'm not even sure how to create raw files and there seems very little support for BBC floppy format etc.

Any additional help and info as to when kryoflux will be upgraded to be much more useful for us BBC micro gurus will be very much appreciated,

I would appreciate if someone could tell me as much as they can about kryoflux and re install some faith back in to me about this archiving system, it seems amiga and comadore are much better supported than us bbc boys?


I thank you in advance for your reply email

Kind Regards

John
Last edited by johnnysh on Wed Jun 12, 2013 3:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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leenew
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Re: kyroflux for the BBC

Postby leenew » Wed Jun 12, 2013 2:06 pm

I think DanielJ is making good progress, you may wish to search for some of his posts.
Cheers,
Lee.

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danielj
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Re: kyroflux for the BBC

Postby danielj » Wed Jun 12, 2013 2:10 pm

Hello,

DISCLAIMER: I'm just me, nothing to do with SPS or Kryoflux

BBC DFS format is supported by the generic FM format. The sector images you can create with that are compatible with emulators and also the RetroClinic Datacentre. You can use something like DFSExplorer to remove individual files and manipulate the images.

BBC/Arc ADFS format is supported by the generic MFM format. ADFSExplorer is the business for these.

Protected discs are a different kettle of fish. I'm working on BBC ones, but I haven't had much time to devote to it.

Archimedes is sorted though and I can convert the raw files to APD files which work with emulators and also ADFFS which lets the images be used on real hardware.

Currently there's no way of writing these back to disc but I am looking at how to convert the images to IPF files that the kryoflux will be able to write (at present there is no support from SPS for creating IPF files with FM flux streams).

Feel free to nudge me with any questions and I'll do my best to help.

d.

edit: I should also say in its defence, the kryoflux can get stuff off the disc that you'd never be able to manage to retrieve any other way, especially if some of the sectors are screwy...

further edit:
If you can create ssd/dsd files and you don't have a DataCentre, you can use a real beeb to write them back to disc with UPURS - http://www.retro-kit.co.uk/UPURS/

d.

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simonm
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Re: kryoflux for the BBC

Postby simonm » Thu Sep 21, 2017 4:16 pm

Have just stumbled upon Kyroflux as a "thing" and it sounds excellent as a I have a ton of old 5.25" beeb floppies that need archiving and I like the comforting sound of an analogue capture direct to PC. If anyone has any tips on which drives work best with it that would be good. Also if anyone has one for sale or temporary lend in exchange for beer I'd be interested. [-o<

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danielj
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Re: kryoflux for the BBC

Postby danielj » Thu Sep 21, 2017 6:32 pm

Best drive is a 1.2MB PC one, that will deal with pretty much anything you throw at it. Mine's in use I'm afraid :(

d.

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simonm
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Re: kryoflux for the BBC

Postby simonm » Thu Sep 21, 2017 9:39 pm

Good to know, thanks. Had no idea that old pc 5.25" drives were so rare now, hardly any on ebay and what is on there is £100!!! :shock:

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hjalfi
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Re: kryoflux for the BBC

Postby hjalfi » Thu Sep 28, 2017 6:38 am

I used a Kryoflux a while back to get the files off a twenty-five year old DFS floppy. It's a bit weird, but worked well. The bit you're missing is that there are three distinct tools:

- you use the Kryoflux to record the magnetic state of the disk;
- then you use one of Kyroflux's analysis tools to turn this magnetic state file into a disk image;
- then you use a standard BBC DFS decoder to get the files out of the disk image.

The key part is that the Kryoflux itself records the raw magnetic state. The MFM/FM/number of sectors/etc decoding happens in a separate stage. All you need to know to get the magnetic state is the track spacing. So, you get to record the disk state once, and then do the analysis later.

I can't remember the exact details, but I know that there was a turnkey tool which could turn a magstate image into a .ssd disk image. The UI is painfully cryptic, sadly, but it worked.

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danielj
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Re: kryoflux for the BBC

Postby danielj » Thu Sep 28, 2017 7:22 am

The UI does give you a few options for output formats, essentially just sector images which are either interleaved or not. In theory it should be able to magically divine the right format, but it doesn't always seem to work, so you do have to tell it what to expect. I've found it pretty good - especially for reading through errors, as it will stick everything it can get off the disk into a file, even if it doesn't checksum properly.

The kryoflux software does let you do the "read-the-fluxes" and "convert to sector image" stages simultaneously. It will also let you write flux images back to floppy. I believe they're developing some proper mastering software which will be released in due course.

d.


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