A3010 hard disc interface

Arc/RPCs, peripherals, RISCOS operating system & ARM kit eg GP2x, BeagleBoard
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vectorlight
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Re: A3010 hard disc interface

Postby vectorlight » Wed Mar 08, 2017 5:00 pm

I discovered an interesting "problem" today with this and this may be connected to the problems munchausen has had (or it may just be an issue with mine only) but I'll post it here in case anyone has any ideas.

The problem is that up until now I've been using a 20CM cable, this has worked fine, no problems at all. However I was today re-jigging it and connected the CF adaptor to a really shot cable, probably 5CM and suddenly the drives are not recognised. I tried another super short cable, 2CM I think, and the same happens. The drives appear when booted as numbers 4 & 5 (not their names) and clicking on them gives an error saying they are not formatted.

This seems very strange to me, I would have thought the longer cable would be the problematic one #-o

Anyway, does anyone have any ideas why the different cables would give such different results. I can't remember where I got the shorter cables from they may just be cheap Chinese things. :shock:
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sirbod
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Re: A3010 hard disc interface

Postby sirbod » Wed Mar 08, 2017 5:40 pm

vectorlight wrote:The drives appear when booted as numbers 4 & 5 (not their names) and clicking on them gives an error saying they are not formatted.

Interesting, the same symptom I'm seeing on my A7000, although I have normal length cables. As far as I remember there's no minimum length for ATA cables , but there was a maximum length of 45cm.

SteveBagley
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Re: A3010 hard disc interface

Postby SteveBagley » Thu Mar 09, 2017 12:18 pm

vectorlight wrote:The problem is that up until now I've been using a 20CM cable, this has worked fine, no problems at all. However I was today re-jigging it and connected the CF adaptor to a really shot cable, probably 5CM and suddenly the drives are not recognised. I tried another super short cable, 2CM I think, and the same happens. The drives appear when booted as numbers 4 & 5 (not their names) and clicking on them gives an error saying they are not formatted.


Just a thought but are the shorter cables the 80-way variety as opposed to the 40-way one shown in your photo? I had a weird issue the other day where a USB to IDE converter wouldn't recognise drives when using an 80-way cable but was fine with a 40-way…

Steve

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vectorlight
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Re: A3010 hard disc interface

Postby vectorlight » Fri Mar 10, 2017 2:22 pm

SteveBagley wrote:Just a thought but are the shorter cables the 80-way variety as opposed to the 40-way one shown in your photo? I had a weird issue the other day where a USB to IDE converter wouldn't recognise drives when using an 80-way cable but was fine with a 40-way…

Steve

Thanks Steve, I'm using a 44-way cable. I'm going to just leave it on the 20CM cable for now, but I thought it may be something for munchausen to try :D
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Ste
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Re: A3010 hard disc interface

Postby Ste » Sat Jun 10, 2017 2:09 am

Hi guys, is anyone still working on this project as this is something I'd really like to try. If anyone could give me any tips that would be great.

aotta
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Re: A3010 hard disc interface

Postby aotta » Mon Jun 12, 2017 10:52 am

I am interested too... i would like to study this solution for my A3000, if possible. Any update?

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danielj
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Re: A3010 hard disc interface

Postby danielj » Mon Jun 12, 2017 11:33 am

It won't work on the A3000 as it doesn't have the requisite controller IC unfortunately. Have a look here:

viewtopic.php?f=16&t=12884

d.

aotta
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Re: A3010 hard disc interface

Postby aotta » Mon Jun 12, 2017 12:38 pm

danielj wrote:It won't work on the A3000 as it doesn't have the requisite controller IC unfortunately. Have a look here:

viewtopic.php?f=16&t=12884

d.


Thank you for the answer.... so the ARM2 hasn't the IC like the Arm250 one? But no DIY project for a IDE podule for the A3000?
i'm looking for it but still found nothing... :(

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danielj
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Re: A3010 hard disc interface

Postby danielj » Mon Jun 12, 2017 1:12 pm

No, the F82C711 is a multi-IO controller that includes parallel, IDE, Floppy. The A3000 uses a WD1772, which is just a floppy controller, so any IDE interface needs additional circuitry to be added. You can do this with the A3010 as the right controller's there, it's just a question of adding the bits that the A3020 has that the A3010 doesn't.

d.

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Re: A3010 hard disc interface

Postby Zarchos » Mon Jun 12, 2017 3:00 pm

aotta wrote:
danielj wrote:It won't work on the A3000 as it doesn't have the requisite controller IC unfortunately. Have a look here:

viewtopic.php?f=16&t=12884

d.


Thank you for the answer.... so the ARM2 hasn't the IC like the Arm250 one? But no DIY project for a IDE podule for the A3000?
i'm looking for it but still found nothing... :(


It's not ARM2 or ARM250, it is A3000 or A3010 ...
Your A3000 can accept a full size podule and there are some on sale on Ebay ... IDE or why not SCSI, it has many advantages.

Ste
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Re: A3010 hard disc interface

Postby Ste » Tue Jun 13, 2017 8:13 pm

Actually a podule would suit my purposes, but I can't seem to find any for the A3010 on Ebay. Do you know of anywhere else that has them?

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Re: A3010 hard disc interface

Postby danielj » Tue Jun 13, 2017 8:27 pm

Minipodule IDE interfaces are rocking horse poop I'm afraid :(

CJE will sell you one for lots of money, but they rarely appear on ebay these days:
http://www.cjemicros.co.uk/micros/price ... aces.shtml

d.

Zarchos
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Re: A3010 hard disc interface

Postby Zarchos » Tue Jun 13, 2017 8:49 pm

Ste wrote:Actually a podule would suit my purposes, but I can't seem to find any for the A3010 on Ebay. Do you know of anywhere else that has them?


No expansion connector at the back of the A3010 or A3020, contrary to the A3000 ... so no full size podule.
Acorn has been really mean on this.
I wonder if there is a lot of circuitry to add to the ARM250 based machines to allow them to accept a full size podule ... with a bit of dremmeling the casing .... ?

Ste
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Re: A3010 hard disc interface

Postby Ste » Wed Jun 14, 2017 2:44 pm

Ah right. Thanks for the replies guys. I think I'll stick with attempting the mod then as the CJE ones cost more than what I paid for the A3010 itself.

Ste
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Re: A3010 hard disc interface

Postby Ste » Tue Jun 20, 2017 7:17 pm

No one seems to be talking about this anymore in the other thread so I'm not really sure what my next step should be.

I'm assuming I would have to buy the bare board directly from Vectorlight. If so how would I contact him? I can't send PM's yet as I've not been on the forum long enough.

There's probably a way to make these yourself or send off for them to be made or something, but I don't know anything about that. If anyone's got any tips on that I'd be willing to give it a go.

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danielj
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Re: A3010 hard disc interface

Postby danielj » Tue Jun 20, 2017 7:26 pm

Hi Ste, enabling PMs for you.

d.

Zarchos
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Re: A3010 hard disc interface

Postby Zarchos » Tue Jun 20, 2017 8:39 pm

There were 2 listed by Ifel for GBP40 each and they sold fast !
With 1 Gbyte ... brand new.
I must have missed them for 5 seconds at most ...

Ste
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Re: A3010 hard disc interface

Postby Ste » Wed Jun 21, 2017 5:57 pm

danielj wrote:Hi Ste, enabling PMs for you.

d.


Thanks! :D

Zarchos wrote:There were 2 listed by Ifel for GBP40 each and they sold fast !
With 1 Gbyte ... brand new.
I must have missed them for 5 seconds at most ...


Ah that's a shame, quite affordable price!
But I thought there was some issue with the A3010 detecting anything over 100 or so megabytes.

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danielj
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Re: A3010 hard disc interface

Postby danielj » Wed Jun 21, 2017 6:00 pm

It can deal with up to 512mb as a partition (slightly smaller is preferable to stop the allocation blocks being ridiculous sizes), but only one partition per drive unless you employ something like poweride or whizzofs which allow for multiple partitions. It doesn't matter, however, if the drive is larger than 512mb, you just won't be able to use it all. I have a 2gb drive in my A3020.

d.

Zarchos
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Re: A3010 hard disc interface

Postby Zarchos » Wed Jun 21, 2017 6:56 pm

I do not know what the Simtec board uses but I can guarantee I have 2 partitions about 500 Mbytes each with a 1 Gbyte CF card.
I wonder if it is not with Simtec you can get up to 8 partitions ...

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danielj
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Re: A3010 hard disc interface

Postby danielj » Wed Jun 21, 2017 8:16 pm

I was just talking about the on-board IDE :)

d.

Zarchos
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Re: A3010 hard disc interface

Postby Zarchos » Wed Jun 21, 2017 9:16 pm

danielj wrote:I was just talking about the on-board IDE :)

d.


Ah ok ... to me you were answering to the previous thread where the author states 'A3010' ... but then the thread is about turning A3010s into A3020s so it makes sense ;-)

gazzaD
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Re: A3010 hard disc interface

Postby gazzaD » Tue Jun 27, 2017 5:48 pm

If anyone is looking for an A3020 compatible CF drive, I've had success with these. I've no connection to the vendor, just a happy customer. There seem to be a lot of fake SanDisk cards on ebay, but they are easy to spot from the photos once you know what to look for.

This was the shape I used to get 499MB out of them.

Code: Select all

IDE drive ADFS:4 identifies itself as :
Description      : SanDisk SDCFH2-2048                     
Firmware version : HDX 4.04
Configuration    : 3970 cylinders, 16 heads and 63 sectors/track

This drive supports the LBA (Logical Block Address) option.
This disc was last formatted using the non-standard disc shape :
          1015 Cylinders, 16 Heads and 63 Sectors/Track
          Parking cylinder 7, Initialisation flag 1, LBA flag 1


The CF interfaces are pretty much passive, so don't make a huge amount of difference which one you use. Although if you want to mount the card sensibly then the dual interfaces usually have mounting holes that match the A3020 case.
Gareth


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