Today I overclocked my A3010

Arc/RPCs, peripherals, RISCOS operating system & ARM kit eg GP2x, BeagleBoard
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Re: Today I overclocked my A3010

Postby SarahWalker » Sun Jun 19, 2016 3:12 pm

BigEd wrote:I think:
ARM1, 3 micron technology, about 1985
ARM3, 2 micron technology, about 1991
ARM250 0.8 micron technology, about 1992
but would be happy to be corrected. These linear shrinks need to be squared to get the area decrease: from 2 to 0.8 gives you a factor of six in area.

ARM2 was 2 micron (1987), ARM3 was 0.8 micron I think (1989/1990). Not sure about ARM250.

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Re: Today I overclocked my A3010

Postby BigEd » Sun Jun 19, 2016 3:14 pm

Thanks. I've annotated my post!

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Re: Today I overclocked my A3010

Postby vectorlight » Tue Jun 21, 2016 12:03 pm

AndyMc1280 wrote:PS your pictures at the beginning of the thread have gone... :(


Sorry yeah I've been moving them around. They are here on my website, I'll update the links in this thread later on...

http://www.vectorlight.net/retro/computers-and-modifications/acorn-archimedes-a3010-arm250-overclock
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Re: Today I overclocked my A3010

Postby Zarchos » Tue Jun 21, 2016 1:27 pm

vectorlight wrote:
AndyMc1280 wrote:PS your pictures at the beginning of the thread have gone... :(


Sorry yeah I've been moving them around. They are here on my website, I'll update the links in this thread later on...

http://www.vectorlight.net/retro/computers-and-modifications/acorn-archimedes-a3010-arm250-overclock


Hey !
- The A3010 hasn't got a funtional IDE onboard, but the controller chip is present (See Munchausen project to bring IDE to the A3010, 'simply' building what is missing between the A3020 and the A3010).
- ARM250 at 12 Mhz isn't 'a slightly faster version of the ARM2' when you jump from 4-4,5 MIPS to 6,5-7 MIPS ...

I noticed 4 typos :
'the' in this sentence :
'RAM when the clocked at 12MHZ
'
'ROM's' instead of 'ROMs' a bit further.

'noticable' instead of 'noticeable'
'slugish' instead of 'sluggish'

oh yes I know I'm a pain in the ar#@ :lol: so I stop at 4.

Great site, btw, and an excellent job for this article.
Thanks of course for your initial idea to push overclocking to the max !

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Re: Today I overclocked my A3010

Postby vectorlight » Tue Jun 21, 2016 4:37 pm

Zarchos wrote:Thanks of course for your initial idea to push overclocking to the max !


Thanks for that Zarchos I'll go through and make some ammends. I really should get a spellchecker plugged in to the website CMS :D

I wrote that article mainly so in 10 years time I'll know what I did as forum threads tend to vanish or get culled after a while :D
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Re: Today I overclocked my A3010

Postby 1024MAK » Tue Jun 21, 2016 7:46 pm

This forum is a cull free zone :lol:

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Re: Today I overclocked my A3010

Postby AndyMc1280 » Tue Jun 21, 2016 7:51 pm




Thanks - its only so that I can direct my friend where to solder in the socket for the crystal/resistor once I get one of Munchausen's boards (what value resistor did you use?)

Also I'd like to know, just out of interest what version of the FPEmulator module are you using ? *help fpemulator should do it.

I ask because the version of ArmSi that you use 4.00 crashes when I try to do the FPU test, it tells me I need Fpemulator loaded (I do have it)


For some sort of CPU comparison, here's mine with Arm 3 @ 30Mhz with 12Mhz ram running V4.00 of Arm Si - vectorlight's A3010 is quicker :twisted: :lol: But it wont do the FPU test for me so I don't use that version :P

Image

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Re: Today I overclocked my A3010

Postby vectorlight » Tue Jun 21, 2016 8:37 pm

The resistor is 220 ohm, but you will not need it in your case. I think on your mezzanine A3010 board it is a case of replacing the existing 36mhz crystal? ARM250 machines have a single 72MHZ crystal, your PCB is different and has 24mhz and 36mhz crystals that drive the ARM2, MEMC, VIDC & IO.

From reading this article http://qubeserver.com/qube/projects/A4000overclocking.html he touches on the A3010 mezzanine board and it looks like replacing the 36mhz crystal you will overclock the MEMC, RAM & VIDC.

You'll need to get an expert to confirm which crystal needs to be replaced (I am not one I'm afraid #-o ). I'm sure someone out there will know more about this :o
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Re: Today I overclocked my A3010

Postby vectorlight » Tue Jun 21, 2016 8:39 pm

AndyMc1280 wrote:Also I'd like to know, just out of interest what version of the FPEmulator module are you using ? *help fpemulator should do it.

I ask because the version of ArmSi that you use 4.00 crashes when I try to do the FPU test, it tells me I need Fpemulator loaded (I do have it)


I'll have a look in a mo, I haven't replaced it, so it should be whatever version is in the 3.1 ROMs, unless the Uniboot replaces it? I'll have a look and let you know.
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Re: Today I overclocked my A3010

Postby vectorlight » Tue Jun 21, 2016 9:25 pm

1024MAK wrote:This forum is a cull free zone :lol:

Mark


Thats cool, glad to know it'll be around for a long time to come. :D I remember a forum I ran a while ago was limited to 500MB of database storage and culling was a necessary evil unless I was willing to pay extortionate fees for more storage space :shock:
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Re: Today I overclocked my A3010

Postby Zarchos » Tue Jun 21, 2016 9:36 pm

It's off topic but ... Seeing your avatar : have you got a C5 ? I do ...

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Re: Today I overclocked my A3010

Postby AndyMc1280 » Tue Jun 21, 2016 9:41 pm

vectorlight wrote:The resistor is 220 ohm, but you will not need it in your case. I think on your mezzanine A3010 board it is a case of replacing the existing 36mhz crystal? ARM250 machines have a single 72MHZ crystal, your PCB is different and has 24mhz and 36mhz crystals that drive the ARM2, MEMC, VIDC & IO.

From reading this article http://qubeserver.com/qube/projects/A4000overclocking.html he touches on the A3010 mezzanine board and it looks like replacing the 36mhz crystal you will overclock the MEMC, RAM & VIDC.

You'll need to get an expert to confirm which crystal needs to be replaced (I am not one I'm afraid #-o ). I'm sure someone out there will know more about this :o



Thanks for the heads up :D I shall look for further info before I change things. it has a 60 Mhz crystal driving the Arm3 and FPA (on the upgrade board) so I shall make further enquiries.
Speaking of which
Old quote but Paul knows the innards of my machine better than I do -

paulv wrote:That's very cool...

@Andrew, when you read this thread... yes, you could do this to your ARM3 A3010 as you have the IFEL RAM board too....

Paul



What say you Mr V ? :lol:

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Re: Today I overclocked my A3010

Postby paulv » Tue Jun 21, 2016 10:04 pm

AndyMc1280 wrote:Thanks for the heads up :D I shall look for further info before I change things. it has a 60 Mhz crystal driving the Arm3 and FPA (on the upgrade board) so I shall make further enquiries.
Speaking of which
Old quote but Paul knows the innards of my machine better than I do -


Yes, the benefit of the ARM3 on board is that it has it's own clock so is somewhat decoupled from overclocking your motherboard.

AndyMc1280 wrote:
paulv wrote:That's very cool...

@Andrew, when you read this thread... yes, you could do this to your ARM3 A3010 as you have the IFEL RAM board too....

Paul



What say you Mr V ? :lol:


What say all? :lol: :lol: Sorry, old inside joke from a time where we went to an Xmas bash at Coombe Abbey.

I'd need to take a look at the schematics of the A3010 to refresh my memory but it's using a divisor from either a 72, 36 or 24MHz clock to achieve the 12MHz clock speed. Looking at your motherboard there's a 24MHz and 36Mhz oscillator fitted with a 25.175Mhz crystal fitted too so between them they provide the standard clocks for VIDC and the sysclock may well be derived from the 36 or 24MHz clock. You can clearly see there were design ideas about adding a fourth oscillator to the PCB but the via's and traces were not added to your version of the motherboard.

Reading the A4000 hack, it seems that the "spare" socket comes into play when overclocking the machine so I'm thinking that the hack for an Adelaide A3010 would be quite different to that of the A4000, but still doable.

Essentially, you'd have to interrupt the circuit so that the 24MHz clock which would be used to clock VIDC and the motherboard at 12MHz would only drive the motherboard. You could then remove the 24MHz oscillator from the PCB and attach it to the VIDC clock MUX directly and stick a faster oscillator into the normal position on the PCB to overclock the rest of the motherboard. It would not be a pretty hack.

Of course, this is subject to reading the Adelaide based schematics but on first blush that's my guess.

Paul

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Re: Today I overclocked my A3010

Postby Zarchos » Tue Jun 21, 2016 10:19 pm

And Andy is a really lucky man because his RAM chips are 60 ns, not 70 ns ...

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Re: Today I overclocked my A3010

Postby AndyMc1280 » Tue Jun 21, 2016 10:54 pm

Zarchos wrote:And Andy is a really lucky man because his RAM chips are 60 ns, not 70 ns ...

They'll be 50ns when I upgrade :D

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Re: Today I overclocked my A3010

Postby vectorlight » Wed Jun 22, 2016 6:35 am

Zarchos wrote:It's off topic but ... Seeing your avatar : have you got a C5 ? I do ...


Yes, I'm guilty of owning 2 C5's. I run the c5owners.com / FB group so any C5 info. you need just ask over there. I want to avoid mentioning the name Sinclair too much on an Acorn forum, I'll probably get thrown off :D
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Re: Today I overclocked my A3010

Postby Zarchos » Wed Jun 22, 2016 7:06 am

vectorlight wrote:
Zarchos wrote:It's off topic but ... Seeing your avatar : have you got a C5 ? I do ...


Yes, I'm guilty of owning 2 C5's. I run the c5owners.com / FB group so any C5 info. you need just ask over there. I want to avoid mentioning the name Sinclair too much on an Acorn forum, I'll probably get thrown off :D


Wow interesting.
I remember when I brought back home my C5 and numerous spares (including several engines), all this in my X5, and thinking 'Man, I'm really crazy with these British inventions, and I like it'.
Never dared driving on the roads here with it/him/her but I'm so happy I own one :lol:
Probably you know the cool and helpful person who sold it to me, and took some time to demonstrate how to use the ... pedals :wink:
I definitely need the Sinclair bike now, to wait until the arrival of the flying car :roll:

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Re: Today I overclocked my A3010

Postby 1024MAK » Wed Jun 22, 2016 7:22 am

vectorlight wrote:
Zarchos wrote:It's off topic but ... Seeing your avatar : have you got a C5 ? I do ...


Yes, I'm guilty of owning 2 C5's. I run the c5owners.com / FB group so any C5 info. you need just ask over there. I want to avoid mentioning the name Sinclair too much on an Acorn forum, I'll probably get thrown off :D

It's okay, I think you just about got away with it :lol:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K2k1iRD2f-c

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Re: Today I overclocked my A3010

Postby Zarchos » Wed Jun 22, 2016 7:33 am


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Re: Today I overclocked my A3010

Postby Zarchos » Wed Jun 22, 2016 9:17 am

For the A3020 and the A4000, this type of board
http://chrisacorns.computinghistory.org ... 0_RAM.html
is, I believe, interesting to build to install the 50 ns RAM chips.

I don't know if the extra memory installed adds to the onboard memory or not (in the latter case, it means one will have to desolder the 'slow' onboard RAM chips on the motherboard to replace by the faster 50ns chips).

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Re: Today I overclocked my A3010

Postby vectorlight » Wed Jun 22, 2016 12:25 pm

Zarchos wrote:For the A3020 and the A4000, this type of board
http://chrisacorns.computinghistory.org ... 0_RAM.html
is, I believe, interesting to build to install the 50 ns RAM chips.


Perhaps munchausen can help cloning one of these boards? You could probably do faster 30ns ram?
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Re: Today I overclocked my A3010

Postby vectorlight » Wed Jun 22, 2016 12:38 pm

AndyMc1280 wrote:Also I'd like to know, just out of interest what version of the FPEmulator module are you using ? *help fpemulator should do it.


Just did this, mine is V2.87 from 9/12/1991 which I assume is the ROM version. I've no idea where updates for this can be downloaded from. Searches for RISC OS stuff for me usually ends up at a broken link :shock:
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Re: Today I overclocked my A3010

Postby Zarchos » Wed Jun 22, 2016 12:52 pm

vectorlight wrote:
Zarchos wrote:For the A3020 and the A4000, this type of board
http://chrisacorns.computinghistory.org ... 0_RAM.html
is, I believe, interesting to build to install the 50 ns RAM chips.


Perhaps munchausen can help cloning one of these boards? You could probably do faster 30ns ram?


There's a compatable type of DRAM able to be refreshed that fast, really ?

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Re: Today I overclocked my A3010

Postby AndyMc1280 » Wed Jun 22, 2016 3:23 pm

vectorlight wrote:
AndyMc1280 wrote:Also I'd like to know, just out of interest what version of the FPEmulator module are you using ? *help fpemulator should do it.


Just did this, mine is V2.87 from 9/12/1991 which I assume is the ROM version. I've no idea where updates for this can be downloaded from. Searches for RISC OS stuff for me usually ends up at a broken link :shock:


Ouch that's old!
Risc OS open maintain ! system downloads for older machines. Try this

https://www.riscosopen.org/zipfiles/pla ... 1466322791

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Re: Today I overclocked my A3010

Postby vectorlight » Thu Jun 23, 2016 12:34 pm

AndyMc1280 wrote:Ouch that's old!
Risc OS open maintain ! system downloads for older machines. Try this

https://www.riscosopen.org/zipfiles/pla ... 1466322791


That's great, thanks very much I'm all up-to-date now :D
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Re: Today I overclocked my A3010

Postby munchausen » Thu Jun 23, 2016 12:48 pm

Small update: I haven't finalised the design yet as RL is getting in the way. I will get it sorted soon though ;)

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Re: Today I overclocked my A3010

Postby AndyMc1280 » Thu Jun 23, 2016 10:31 pm

munchausen wrote:Small update: I haven't finalised the design yet as RL is getting in the way. I will get it sorted soon though ;)


Don't stress :wink: Thanks for the update anyway

vectorlight wrote:
AndyMc1280 wrote:Ouch that's old!
Risc OS open maintain ! system downloads for older machines. Try this

https://www.riscosopen.org/zipfiles/pla ... 1466322791


That's great, thanks very much I'm all up-to-date now :D


You're welcome :D it is worth keeping an eye on every few weeks.

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Re: Today I overclocked my A3010

Postby AndyMc1280 » Thu Jun 23, 2016 10:36 pm

*Snipped all the irrelevant jazz about sinclair c5's* :lol:



This is gold. I bet John Cleese has an Archimedes, Ronnie Barker an Amiga and Ronnie Corbett an Atari ST *Puts on tin hat* :shock: :lol:

RIP The Two Ronnies :(

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Re: Today I overclocked my A3010

Postby munchausen » Fri Jun 24, 2016 10:42 pm

vectorlight, how much did you have to shave off of the SOJ sockets to get them to fit? After quite a lot of wrangling, I've finished the design with the correct measurements, and by jove is it tight! I think each socket will need to slim down by at least a couple of mm to fit.

FWIW, measuring between the outside rows of pins on the two connectors, from the centre point of the pins, I make the distance to be 37.5mm, to within 0.1mm +/- my eyesight. The diameter of the pins on my upgrade are 0.6mm and the length sticking out of the board at the bottom is 4mm.

Here is the final design (almost anyway, want to tidy up some tiny things). I'll start ordering stuff tomorrow.

a3010 ifel clone 3 top.png

a3010 ifel clone 3 bottom.png

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Re: Today I overclocked my A3010

Postby BigEd » Sat Jun 25, 2016 5:49 am

Possible idea: move those two vias which sit between the headers and the surface mount pads to be outboard of the header holes - even if you need three or four vias, you'll have more space between the headers, at the expense of a slightly wider board. (I'm assuming a slightly wider board will still fit!)


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