Educational Resources

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richmond62
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Educational Resources

Postby richmond62 » Tue Jun 20, 2017 5:55 pm

I wonder if there exists something like this:

http://www.computing.outwood.com/NEA/

for BBC BASIC.

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flaxcottage
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Re: Educational Resources

Postby flaxcottage » Tue Jun 20, 2017 10:13 pm

No. BBC BASIC is not an accepted language by AQA or OCR for their NEAs.

They do accept Python, VB, Pascal/Delphi, Java, C#.

At one time, for the previous specification, I managed to convince OCR that BBC BASIC for Windows was a suitable language for GCSE. It was a big form to complete and BBC BASIC for Windows exceeded their requirements and so was accepted.

It is a shame because the language is perfect for GCSE projects. It does not translate so well into A-Level due to its lack of objects. Mind you it is slightly better than Python plus the Tkinter interface even without objects. The best programmers seem to use VB, Delphi, Java or C# at A-Level from personal experience.

The AQA A-Level NEA would allow a candidate to submit a project written in BBC BASIC and, theoretically, full marks could be obtained. At least under this scenario one could be sure that the candidate had not downloaded the solution from somewhere and passed it of as their own! :D
- John

Currently running Level 4 Econet with BBC B, BBC B+ 128K, Master 128K, 4Mb A3000, 4Mb A3020, 4Mb A4000, 4Mb A5000 dual FDD; UK101; HP41CX setup; Psion 3a, 3mx and 5mx; Z88; TI-58c, TI-59 and printer, HP-16C programmer's calculator

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davidb
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Re: Educational Resources

Postby davidb » Tue Jun 20, 2017 10:55 pm

Have you seen FUZE BASIC? It looks like a proprietary BASIC dialect that's being heavily pushed at schools.

Amusingly, despite being touted as "Scratching the itch Python can't reach!" on its home page, the download page contains the following text:
While you can do truly incredible things with FUZE BASIC it is not intended to replace professional 'real-world' languages like C++, Java, PHP, Python and so on. It is however the ideal introduction to advanced and often complex languages such as these.

There's a Programmer's Reference Guide on that page with pages for each of the built-in keywords. There are a lot of those - one could argue too many, really.

Anyway, it would be interesting to hear what you think of it.

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Elminster
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Re: Educational Resources

Postby Elminster » Tue Jun 20, 2017 11:00 pm

My Nephew has a Fuse, my Neice gave me a demo, he was busy playing on PS4. Had some interesting commands but only got a demo of the first 3 demo listings. I will have to try and steal it.

My daughter has a kano I like the terminal adventure and stuff. Good concept.

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richmond62
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Re: Educational Resources

Postby richmond62 » Wed Jun 21, 2017 8:42 am

professional 'real-world' languages like C++, Java, PHP, Python and so on.


That kind of thinking makes me puke.

It is repeatedly levelled against LiveCode because it is object-based.

All of those adjectives (OK, OK, one adjective and one adjectival phrase) are
just about as subjective as "modern" and just about as useful.

about 50 years ago (when I was 5!) my father was trying to unblock a sewage pipe, so went through
all his tools to find something that would fit in the pipe: I went to our sandpit and got a small plastic spade
(neither "professional" nor "real-world") and Daddy was able to unblock the pipe very quickly with it.

Admittedly my father had to go and buy me a new spade for the sandpit after what happened to that one :D

When my wife and I were having fights with an architect about the flat we were building the architect started
banging on about how I needed to buy a professional CAD program to make sense of his diagrams.

I got out the family bucket of LEGO . . . .

This summer children (11-15) who did some LiveCode with me last year are currently doing the odd thing or two in BBC BASIC,
and, as one of them remarked, "Ah, now I understand something with LiveCode", so "Yarboo, sucks" to those who
say BBC BASIC is outmoded or can serve no purpose nowadays.

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richmond62
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Re: Educational Resources

Postby richmond62 » Wed Jun 21, 2017 8:50 am

BBC BASIC is not an accepted language by AQA or OCR for their NEAs.

Wow: my underpants nearly exploded when I saw all those acronyms.

Surely what is needed are not all those daft regulations and those acronyms ("water" and "optical character recognition" :P ),
but teachers who, using their own brains (cough, cough) can get children to learn how to get computers to do things
via programming: surely the means (i.e. which programming language is used) should not matter; what should matter is the
result:
Screen Shot 2017-06-20 at 9.03.10 pm.png
(4.69 KiB) Not downloaded yet

Today (Wed.) the children I am teaching will work with BBC BASIC to get this on the screen,
on Friday they will be using LiveCode to achieve exactly the same thing.

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richmond62
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Re: Educational Resources

Postby richmond62 » Wed Jun 21, 2017 8:58 am

Actually when I asked this:

I wonder if there exists something like this:

I should have indicated that I really cannot be bothered with the NEA, but what I can be bothered about
is the sort of sequential, heirarchy-of-difficulty thing that this lays out as a sort of road map for kids to
follow for self-study of a programming language.

Here in Bulgaria, in July-August temperatures get up to about 45 degs C, and here in Plovdiv that's often with 80% humidity,
so, if kids cannot get away to the mountains (mainly because Mum and Dad have to work) they tend to spend an awful lot
of time in air-conditioned rooms hunched over computers.

Parents have begged me to supply their kids with continuation work as they would far rather their kids are
doing programming than playing endless computer games or trawling the internet for pictures of people showing off
their wobbly bits.

If something of this sort does NOT exist then I shall have to grab my cup of coffee,
turn on the music (currently "on" Alessandro Rolla (late Baroque)
and King Crimson (early 70s Prog Rock) at the moment), and work out this sort of thing for myself,
but, being essentially lazy, I'd rather not.

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flaxcottage
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Re: Educational Resources

Postby flaxcottage » Wed Jun 21, 2017 11:28 am

richmond62 wrote:Here in Bulgaria, in July-August temperatures get up to about 45 degs C, and here in Plovdiv that's often with 80% humidity,
so, if kids cannot get away to the mountains (mainly because Mum and Dad have to work) they tend to spend an awful lot
of time in air-conditioned rooms hunched over computers.


You have air-conditioned computing rooms in Bulgaria? :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:

Here I had to shut down all my BBCs one year because it got so hot in the computer room one of the capacitors melted and spread red liquid on the desk. The girl using it was aghast that her computer was bleeding! The beebs were only reliable up to 30 deg C.

Funny that - the students were deemed OK up to 38 deg C by management but the computers had to be kept below 30 deg C! :lol:
- John

Currently running Level 4 Econet with BBC B, BBC B+ 128K, Master 128K, 4Mb A3000, 4Mb A3020, 4Mb A4000, 4Mb A5000 dual FDD; UK101; HP41CX setup; Psion 3a, 3mx and 5mx; Z88; TI-58c, TI-59 and printer, HP-16C programmer's calculator

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Elminster
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Re: Educational Resources

Postby Elminster » Wed Jun 21, 2017 11:49 am

flaxcottage wrote:Funny that - the students were deemed OK up to 38 deg C by management but the computers had to be kept below 30 deg C! :lol:


The advantage of having them ak home of course is that you can remove the Beeb case and sit in your underwear with Open Windows 1.0

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richmond62
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Re: Educational Resources

Postby richmond62 » Wed Jun 21, 2017 4:32 pm

You have air-conditioned computing rooms in Bulgaria?

Arf, Arf, Arf!

Should I construe this as racist, culturally imperialist, or just plain ignorant? . . . had a lot of fun with the colours there :P

None: because I believe that Political correctness is utter bo**ocks :D

Most houses in Bulgaria have air-cons: our flat has 2, my school has one in every classroom.

-------------------------

By-ther-way: one of my kids on my summer course worked out a way to get Beebdroid
to save home-made programs onto the SIM card in his Android phone!


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